
020 - What is Moral Injury: Debra Fontes
01/31/22 • 36 min
2 Listeners
In the past we've have a limited way to talk about trauma and distress which was helped over 40 years ago when we began using the term PTSD in some situations. But this term doesn't fully cover what every first responder might be going through and I want to introduce you to some of these newer terms and concepts.
My guest today is Debra Fontes. She is a law enforcement chaplain in Sacramento, California, and trains other chaplains. One of the topics she teaches is the subject of moral injury. Moral injury is not PTSD, although it may occur at the same time or come from the same event. Listen to Debra as she walks me through the similarities and differences between Post Traumatic Stress Injury and Moral Injury.
Today you'll hear Debra give encouragement to those who have suffered trauma and challenge police chaplains to speak life and health into our officers' lives. Also listen for the distinction between feeling guilt over something and feeling shame, and what effect that has on an officer at home.
Resources:
The Moral Injury Workbook by Wyatt R. Evans PhD, et al.
Subscribe/Follow here:
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/hey-chaplain/id1570155168
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2CGK9A3BmbFEUEnx3fYZOY
Music is by Chris Haugen from the YouTube Audio Library and by Winking Fox Music from Pixebay.
Hey Chaplain Podcast Episode 020
Thanks for Listening! And, as always, pray for peace in our city.
Subscribe/Follow here:
- Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/hey-chaplain/id1570155168
- Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2CGK9A3BmbFEUEnx3fYZOY
Email us at: [email protected]
You can help keep the show ad-free by buying me a virtual coffee!
https://www.buymeacoffee.com/heychaplain
In the past we've have a limited way to talk about trauma and distress which was helped over 40 years ago when we began using the term PTSD in some situations. But this term doesn't fully cover what every first responder might be going through and I want to introduce you to some of these newer terms and concepts.
My guest today is Debra Fontes. She is a law enforcement chaplain in Sacramento, California, and trains other chaplains. One of the topics she teaches is the subject of moral injury. Moral injury is not PTSD, although it may occur at the same time or come from the same event. Listen to Debra as she walks me through the similarities and differences between Post Traumatic Stress Injury and Moral Injury.
Today you'll hear Debra give encouragement to those who have suffered trauma and challenge police chaplains to speak life and health into our officers' lives. Also listen for the distinction between feeling guilt over something and feeling shame, and what effect that has on an officer at home.
Resources:
The Moral Injury Workbook by Wyatt R. Evans PhD, et al.
Subscribe/Follow here:
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/hey-chaplain/id1570155168
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2CGK9A3BmbFEUEnx3fYZOY
Music is by Chris Haugen from the YouTube Audio Library and by Winking Fox Music from Pixebay.
Hey Chaplain Podcast Episode 020
Thanks for Listening! And, as always, pray for peace in our city.
Subscribe/Follow here:
- Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/hey-chaplain/id1570155168
- Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2CGK9A3BmbFEUEnx3fYZOY
Email us at: [email protected]
You can help keep the show ad-free by buying me a virtual coffee!
https://www.buymeacoffee.com/heychaplain
Previous Episode

019 - Read to Lead II: Joe Grasela
Today we return to the subject of developing leadership skills through reading great books. I'm a big believer in the idea that we should "think before we speak and we should read before we think." Reading good books is critical to building up good leaders. In an age where many people don't read books hardly at all anymore, let me encourage you to invest time in reading. It's a good way to relax, it engages the brain and specifically the imagination in a way that video never can. And if you don't think you can sit down with a book without falling asleep, at least try an audio book and listen to it while you exercise.
My guest today is Captain Joe Grasela. Joe was recommended to me by one of his co-workers and the guest on my last book review episode, Keith Falkner. He told me that Joe was also an avid reader and enthusiastic about learning from history, and that was just about the perfect description. In addition, Joe is also a big fan of podcasts, so this was an easy sell to get him to contribute to the show.
Today you'll hear him recommend three books covering a variety of topics from Mountain Climbing to the Civil War to the nuclear disaster at Chernobyl. Listen to how he draws out leadership lessons from those stories that reflect on his law enforcement background. I'll add in a couple books as well and I'll leave a list of all of the books in the show notes.
Books mentioned in this episode:
- Into Thin Air by Jon Krakauer
- Grant by Ron Chernow
- Vicksburg is the Key by William L. Shea & Terrance J. Winschel
- Vicksburg by Donald L. Miller
- Masters of the Air by Donald L. Miller
- Waterloo by Bernard Cornwell
- Midnight in Chernobyl by Adam Higginbotham
Also recommended:
- Vicksburg 1863: Grant clears the Mississippi by Alan Hankinson
- Staff Ride Handbook for the Vicksburg Campaign, December 1862-July 1863, by Christopher R. Gabel
Subscribe/Follow here:
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/hey-chaplain/id1570155168
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2CGK9A3BmbFEUEnx3fYZOY
Music is by Chris Haugen from the YouTube Audio Library and by Winking Fox Music from Pixebay.
Hey Chaplain Podcast Episode 019
Thanks for Listening! And, as always, pray for peace in our city.
Subscribe/Follow here:
- Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/hey-chaplain/id1570155168
- Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2CGK9A3BmbFEUEnx3fYZOY
Email us at: [email protected]
You can help keep the show ad-free by buying me a virtual coffee!
https://www.buymeacoffee.com/heychaplain
Next Episode

021 - A Calm Voice in the Dark: Manuel DeLeon
Today I'm taking you to the other side of the police radio, to the communications center, to talk about dispatchers. We'll discuss what's happening during a 911 call from the point of view of the call taker and dispatcher. And we'll ask what do officers sometimes not understand about the job of the person on the other side of the radio? And what is life like for that disembodied voice in the dark?
Today I'm talking to Manny DeLeon. He's a supervisor at the Emergency Communications Center in Wyandotte County and he agreed to talk to me about all of this and more. Listen as he talks about the process of taking a call and getting that crucial bit of information in just the nick of time. Also listen to what he says about hiring and the challenge of keeping a communication center staffed. Finally, I ask him what he would most want to see changed in communications.
Resources:
Link to apply at Wyandotte County: wycokck.org/jobs
Subscribe/Follow here:
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/hey-chaplain/id1570155168
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2CGK9A3BmbFEUEnx3fYZOY
Music is by Chris Haugen from the YouTube Audio Library and by Winking Fox Music from Pixebay.
Hey Chaplain Podcast Episode 021
Thanks for Listening! And, as always, pray for peace in our city.
Subscribe/Follow here:
- Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/hey-chaplain/id1570155168
- Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2CGK9A3BmbFEUEnx3fYZOY
Email us at: [email protected]
You can help keep the show ad-free by buying me a virtual coffee!
https://www.buymeacoffee.com/heychaplain
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