Public Defenseless

https://www.yolocounty.org/government/general-government-departments/law-justice/public-defender

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79: What Could Yolo County Public Defenders Do if They Weren't Funded $16 Million Less than the Prosecutors? w/Tracie Olson

Public Defenseless

01/03/23 • 73 min

While not a small county, Yolo County California does not have the size or resources to match the major metropolitan areas of San Francisco, Oakland, L.A., or Sacramento. Yet somehow, Tracie Olson, Chief Public Defender Yolo County, and her team at the Yolo County Public Defender Office are able to maintain a strong holistic public defense practice.

Despite a $16 million dollar budget shortfall compared to the prosecutors, Tracie has been able to establish her office as a pillar in the community. If the county and the state of California were to finally fund the office at even 85% of what the prosecutor’s office received, the health and safety of Yolo County could reach heights no one thought possible!

Guest:

Tracie Olson, Chief Public Defender, Yolo County Public Defender Office

Key Topics:

How Tracie got started in Indigent Defense [8:30]

Demographics and layout of Yolo County California [13:25]

Where the Yolo County Public Defender Office sits California’s Public Defense System [15:30]

Funding disparity between California Prosecutors and Public Defenders, and what Tracie can do despite the disparity [17:43]

Community Response to the disparity in Prosecutor and Public Defense Funding [21:20]

The impacts of the “tough on crime” media narratives over the past few years on Yolo County [27:50]

Trying to address the housing issue in Yolo County [37:30]

What can’t the Yolo County PD office do because of the funding shortage and how is the community hurt as a result [41:25]

Making Public Defense more than a “check box” system [48:20]

Yolo County PD community outreach programs [54:45]

What does California need to do to support public defense? [1:05:45]

Resources:

Yolo County Public Defender Office

Yolo County Public Defender Facebook

https://www.facebook.com/YoloPublicDefense/?modal=admin_todo_tour

Yolo County Public Defender Twitter

https://twitter.com/yolopubdefense

Contact Hunter Parnell:

@PublicDefenselessPodcast

@PDefenselessPod

https://www.aclu.org/other/racist-arrests-tulia-texas

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66: Is Incrementalism Enough to Fix the Criminal Legal System w/Jeff Blackburn

Public Defenseless

11/16/22 • 77 min

Can people incarcerated afford to wait for small, gradual change? What happens to the people incarcerated if the system breaks? What is the right balance between the needs of the current case vs the needs of the future case? How do Public Defenders counter the decades long strategy of the Conservative legal movement with their own strategy?

All these questions, and more, are pondered by Hunter and his guest today, Jeff Blackburn. During his career, Jeff worked as a criminal defense attorney, impact litigation lawyer and helped to found and operate the Texas Innocence Project. Through it all, Jeff’s aimed to foster and execute a strategic vision for indigent defense and civil liberties that counter’s the work of prosecutors and police. In his eyes, public defenders and other justice minded individuals are in the conflict business and the must learn to value the future battles as much as the current ones. To fail to do so will leave them fighting a battle against an enemy that already made the fight unwinnable, but what is the right balance?

Hopefully, this discussion and the myriad of questions that arise from it will spark your own thinking about how to move towards more strategic levels of thinking.

Guest:

Jeff Blackburn, Criminal defense and Impact attorney, Co-Founder, Texas Innocence Project

Key Takeaways:

Jeff’s career [8:30]
What is impact litigation [16:24]
Victory in the Tulia Case and the Lesson’s learned from it [17:20]
The Texas Innocence Project [21:54]
Impacts of the Tim Cole Case [26:00]
Learning strategy from the history NAACP Legal Fund [28:30]
Countering the Conservative Legal Movement [33:38]
Is Incrementalism Enough [38:30]
How to balance current case vs future case [46:00]
The structural/historical obstacles in many state [53:20]
What happens if the system breaks [57:40]
Is education the way to solve this [1:01:00]
The case for hope [1:10:00]

Resources:

Tulia Case:

https://www.austinchronicle.com/news/2002-04-19/85638/

https://www.myplainview.com/news/article/5-million-settlement-reached-in-Tulia-lawsuit-8757623.php

https://www.salon.com/2003/04/09/tulia_2/

Tim Cole’s Case

https://innocenceproject.org/cases/timothy-cole/

Jeff Calling out Dallas’ Wrongful Conviction Issues

https://innocenceproject.org/deconstructing-dallas-the-county-with-more-dna-exonerations-than-any-other/

Why Jeff Left the Innocence Project

https://www.sacurrent.com/news/texas-innocence-project-founder-quits-accuses-colleagues-of-selling-out-2440927

More of Jeff’s Work

austinchronicle.com/news/2008-04-04/608555/

Contact Hunter Parnell:

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64: How Public Defense can Win the Media Battle w/Maggie Shepard

Public Defenseless

11/11/22 • 61 min

How can journalists and public defenders work together to bring awareness to the real issues plaguing our court system? Today, Hunter spoke with Maggie Shepard, Director of Communications at the New Mexico Law Offices of the Public Defender, to discuss how public defenders can use media relations to deepen their connection with the community they are working to protect.

A policy can only be effective if it has adequate momentum behind it and with most offices unwilling to comment publicly, it makes it difficult for the public to fully grasp the issues. There is a lot of bureaucracy in our court system but it does serve a purpose, to protect the rights of the accused. Everytime a public defender refuses to make a comment they miss the opportunity to highlight the deeper issues surrounding the case, which can be done while honoring the anonymity of the client.

Today’s conversation highlights the real need for communication between the public and the courts and between journalists and public defenders.

Guest:

Maggie Shepard, Director of Communications, New Mexico Law Offices of the Public Defender

Key Takeaways:

Utilizing media relations to fight at the systemic level [2:30]
Maggie’s decision to leave journalism to do media relation training [8:10]
How narrative and perception shapes reality [10:15]
Courtroom journalism rarely grants time to scrutinize the power structure at play [14:30]
Deciphering who counts as an “official” source? [19:00]
A different way for journalists to get a powerful and evocative story [28:00]
Teaching public defenders to speak to the broader story unfolding [34:00]
Policy is only as good as the awareness and pressure behind it [39:14]
Bringing media attention to the positive effects of good reform [42:50]
Using language in a way that reminds the public of the process [50:00]
It’s possible for public defenders to have media relations without being quoted [53:00]
Prison reform is the biggest issue facing New Mexico today [55:40]
Teaching journalists what they don’t learn in school [58:00]

Resources:

Contact Maggie

Contact Heather at NAPD

https://www.lopdnm.us/media-ipra/

Memorable Quotes:

“I was tired of being part of the propaganda machine, honestly, I was tired of playing a harmful role in the narratives that I was telling, so I left my job.” [8:19] -Shepard

“There is a desire, within the department, within the attorneys, to learn how to do this better and there is very clearly a need in the community to have better access to the public defense world and for the information we have as public defenders to get out into the world, into our communities.” [9:27] -Shepard

“There’s not a lot of thoughtfulness beyond what's in front of me, the actors and the actions and that’s what we focus on. We might call into question the after and the action but we’re not calling into question the machine, the bigger power structure that’s there.” [14:50] -Shepard

“Good policy, not heard by anybody, isn’t good policy.It’s just a good idea that nobody heard and that's where I think a lot of public defenders and people who want to push these policies fail to understand that policy gets pushed when people hear about it and apply pressure.” [39:14] -Parnell

Contact Hunter Parnell:

USA Today Coverage of those left behind after Ian

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65: What Happened to the Prisoners Stuck in Jail During Hurricane Ian? w/Kathy Smith

Public Defenseless

11/14/22 • 46 min

For Public Defenders who serve in coastal areas, the story on toady’s show will be all too familiar. As Hurricane Ian barrelled toward the Florida coast, a state of emergency was declared and evacuation plans started to come together, but as is almost always the case, no one thought of those incarcerated.

Today, Hunter spoke with Kathy Smith, Chief Public Defender in the 20th Judicial District of Florida, to discuss the impacts of the storm on those left in jail. Dating as far back as memory allows, state’s failed their obligations to protect the lives of people both in and out of jail when natural disasters strike, and Hurricane Ian was no exception. For days, people, many of whom were in jail simply because they could not afford to pay bail, lived with raw sewage and without clean drinking water.

Luckily, no one died from the state’s neglect, but this episode serves as a powerful warning and reminder for those with a duty to protect people’s lives: when a natural disaster strikes, remember the people who cannot evacuate and think of a way to keep them alive.

Guest:

Kathy Smith, Chief Public Defender, 20th Judicial District, Florida

Key Takeaways:

How Kathy got into this work [6:50]
Historical response to natural disasters in the 20th District [10:50]
The response to Hurricane Ian in the 20th District [12:34]
Who was in the Ft Meyer’s jail and what conditions did they face [18:27]
Why pre-trial release is so important [24:42]
Impacts and the way forward after Ian [26:41]
Does Florida care about the Constitution or just the part it likes? [31:00]
Changes for the Future [34:43]
People arrested during the storm [38:00]
Advice to other Public Defenders [41:20]

Resources:

More Coverage on Ian

Miami New Times Coverage

People left in prison during:

Hurricane Ike, Maria, Matthew, Irene etc.

Contact Hunter Parnell:

https://radleybalko.substack.com/

1 Listener

200: The Problems with Public Defense in Alabama, Arizona, Arkansas, Alaska, and California w/Radley Balko

Public Defenseless

01/18/24 • 68 min

Today, Hunter is joined by longtime criminal justice investigative journalist Radley Balko to discuss his newest reporting on Public Defender systems around the country. Over his storied career covering everything from police misconduct to legislation like AEDPA, Radley noticed that at the heart of so many cases was poor access to competent counsel. This spurred him in the fall of 2023 to start an investigative series into the inner workings of each state’s public defender system. Today, Hunter and Radley discuss the first instalment that covered Alabama, Arkansas, Arizona, Alaska, and California.

Guests:

Radley Balko, Investigative Journalist

Resources:

The Watch (Radley’s Podcast)

States of Indigent Defense Part 1

https://radleybalko.substack.com/p/the-states-of-indigent-defense-part

Perpetual Crisis in Indigent Defense

https://radleybalko.substack.com/p/the-perpetual-crisis-in-indigent

Lee Enterprise Arizona

https://tulsaworld.com/news/national/on-the-brink-of-crisis-arizona-s-public-defense-system-hit-hard-with-staffing-shortages/article_36323850-9373-11ed-ae95-77f4bfa2e383.html

Larry Price

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/nation-world/national/article271245217.html#tbl-em-lnvtce7s7qjuyz92fnl

Contact Hunter Parnell:

@PublicDefenselessPodcast

@PDefenselessPod

www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast

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Thank You for the Past Year and the Year to Come

Public Defenseless

12/22/23 • 9 min

Contact Hunter Parnell:

@PublicDefenselessPodcast

@PDefenselessPod

www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast

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223: The New York Law Giving a Second Chance to Criminalized Domestic Violence Survivors w/Elizabeth Isaacs

Public Defenseless

04/03/24 • 65 min

Today, Hunter continues the three-part series on criminalized domestic violence survivors by speaking with Elizabeth Isaacs, an appellate attorney with New York’s Office of Indigent Legal Services. Specifically, the two discuss the Domestic Violence Survivor’s Justice Act, a New York law designed to give post-relief to those whose incarceration is related to their victimization. While certainly not a perfect bill, it is an extremely important and necessary step to understand that people are not simply victims or perpetrators, and that we can attain justice while also acknowledging the humanity of those who did wrong.

Guests:

Elizabeth Isaacs, Appellate Attorney, NY Office of Indigent Legal Services

Resources:

NYILS Website

https://www.ils.ny.gov/

Survivors Justice Project

https://www.sjpny.org/

Background Material on the DVSJA

· Video: Background on DVSJA passage (somewhat dated)

· Some Legislative History (attached):

o 2017 sponsor memo

o Opposition letter by District Attorney Association of the State of New York

o NY Correctional Association response to DA opposition letter

· SJP DVSJA Resource Guide – we wrote this with incarcerated survivors/applicants as the primary audience

· SJP/Sentencing Project Report

· Abby Van Buren article on temporal nexus problem

· Favorable decisions:

o Brenda WW decision (“mutually abusive” relationship did not foreclose DVSJA relief; abuse history must be considered cumulatively; considered applicant’s extensive criminal history in context of her substance abuse, which was related to victimization)

o Patrice Smith decision (court must look at the “full picture” and contemplate cumulative impact of abuse)

o Liz L. decision (the fact that DV history was “factored in” to previous man 1 plea bargain did not make DVSJA resentencing inappropriate)

· Not so favorable:

o People v. Williams (abuse or abusive relationship must be “ongoing” at the time of the offense)

o People v. Fisher (adopting Williams’ temporal holding in case where trans-identifying young person had assaulted her parents, and no expert was called to attempt to explain connection between earlier physical abuse and offense)

o People v. B.N. (many bad holdings/antiquated approach to DV and trauma)

· People v. Addimando – a study in contrasts (note that Nicole Addimando was finally released from prison last week):

o Trial court decision (denying DVSJA relief at initial sentencing for murder 2 in a case with extensively documented abuse; sentencing Nicole Addimando to 19-to-life)

o Appellate decision (reversing and resentencing her to 7.5 years)

29: The Role a Judge can Play in Reforming Public Defense w/Tom Boyd

Public Defenseless

06/29/22 • 58 min

Today, you’ll hear about public defense from the judge’s point of view. Tom Boyd is a former Michigan District Court Judge who currently works in the court administration office.

At one point one of the weakest systems in the United States, his work to improve the indigent system has driven forward the future of Michigan public defense and has left a positive precedent for other states.

The 6th amendment is the ultimate protection against government power that is designed to keep people safe from a government acting out of control.

Many people believe that judges should be held accountable for protecting the constitution, so bettering the public defense system should be more of a priority.

Sharing his unique perspective, your mindset around public defense will be challenged and you’ll see that a lot more than you think goes into fair representation for all.

Key Topics and Takeaways:

Tom’s background and his role in the Michigan indigent system. [6:01]
A judge’s function in the Michigan courtroom. [10:21]
Some history on the Michigan indigent defense system. [16:01]
What gets in the way of constitutionally adequate representation. [21:21]
Prosecutors and public defense. [28:03]
Ending the plea deal epidemic. [34:57]
Tom’s experience being on both sides of the bench. [45:42]
Where Tom wants Michigan public defense to go. [49:39]
Holding prosecutors accountable. [54:00]

Guests:

Tom Boyd, Former Michigan District Court Judge, Michigan State Court Administrator

Resources:

Michigan Indigent Defense Commission

NLADA Report “Race to the Bottom”

Memorable Quotes:

“I want to talk to more than just public defenders. I want to talk to all range of people who are involved in the criminal justice system, because part of reform is going to require that all of the people in the system work together.” (2:07, Hunter)

“When you're the judge at the end of the conversation you win.” (13:35, Tom)

“If we can be crass about it, the judiciary is a service industry.” (22:05, Tom)

“I think that the Michigan indigent defense commission, which is still in its infancy, you know, six years, seven years, something like that. Has established itself as reliable and dedicated to advancement and done a good enough job that there are very few judges who fought the relinquishment of control.” (25:56, Tom)

“There are bad actors in the legal system who take advantage of individuals and they should be found, rooted out, and gotten out of the system.” (48:29, Hunter)

Contact Hunter Parnell: