Metals, Part Two

08/31/22 • 49 min

1 Listener

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time

In the second part of our alchemical journey, we meet what ancient philosophers called the “noble” metals: mercury, silver, and gold. How did a nineteenth-century set designer harness one of the most captivating—and toxic—materials in the world and wind up as one of the fathers of photography? When does a coin go from a piece of stamped metal to an act of faith? And how did gold in Ghana go from dust in the water to a touchstone of language, story, and the strength of an empire?

Guests:

Yaëlle Biro, former associate curator for the Arts of Africa, African Art in The Michael C. Rockefeller Wing, The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Daniel Carrillo, studio photographer
Benjamin Harnett, independent scholar of ancient technology and digital engineer, The New York Times
Marco Leona, David H. Koch Scientist in Charge, Scientific Research, The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Irene Soto Marín, economic historian and assistant professor of ancient history, Harvard University
Yaw Nyarko, professor of Economics, New York University
Stephen Pinson, curator, Photographs, The Metropolitan Museum of Art

Objects featured in this episode:

Works of Louis-Jacques-Mandé Daguerre (various)
Roman coins (various)
Staff of Office: Figures, spider web and spider motif (ȯkyeame), 19th–early 20th century. Ghana. Akan peoples, Asante group. Wood, gold foil, nails, H. 61 5/8 x W. 5 3/4 x D. 2 1/4 in. (156.5 x 14.6 x 5.7 cm). The Metropolitan Museum of Art, New York, Gift of the Richard J. Faletti Family, 1986 (1986.475a-c)

For a transcript of this episode and more information, visit metmuseum.org/immaterial

#MetImmaterial

Immaterial is produced by The Metropolitan Museum of Art and Magnificent Noise and hosted by Camile Dungy. This episode was produced by Adwoa Gyimah-Brempong.

Special thanks to Alan Shapiro, Bobby Walsh, Lauren Johnson, and Kwabena and Rose Gyimah-Brempong.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Guests:

Objects featured in this episode:

For a transcript of this episode and more information, visit metmuseum.org/immaterial

#MetImmaterial

Immaterial is produced by The Metropolitan Museum of Art and Magnificent Noise and hosted by Camile Dungy. This episode was produced by Adwoa Gyimah-Brempong.

Special thanks to Alan Shapiro, Bobby Walsh, Lauren Johnson, and Kwabena and Rose Gyimah-Brempong.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Previous Episode

Metals, Part One

Philosophers and scientists have tried for millennia to crack the code of alchemy: the art of turning lead into gold. But alchemy goes much deeper than that—it gives us a framework for turning metal into story. In the first of a two-part episode on the metals of alchemy, we explore iron, bronze, lead, and copper. Our stories go deep into the basement of The Met, and back in time to a waterlogged ancient tomb. You’ll hear about books that dazzle, puppets that weep, and the long lost sound of a 2000-year-old bell.

Guests:

Edward Hunter, armorer and conservator, Arms and Armor, The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Marco Leona, David H. Koch Scientist in Charge, Scientific Research, The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Ali Olomi, professor of Middle East, Islamic, and Global Southern history, Penn State Abington
Kannia Rifatulzia, translator, In-depth Creative
Defri Simatupang, archaeologist, North Sumatera Archaeology Center, Indonesia
Zhixin Jason Sun, Brooke Russell Astor Curator of Chinese Art, Asian Art, The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Yana Van Dyke, conservator, Paper Conservation, The Metropolitan Museum of Art

Objects featured in this episode:

European armor (various)
Zhong bells (various)
Puppet Head (Si Gale-gale), late 19th–early 20th century. Indonesia, Sumatra. Toba Batak people. Wood, copper alloy, lead alloy, water buffalo horn, paint, H. (without pull rope) 13 1/4 in. x W. 6 in. x D. 6 1/2 in. (33.7 x 15.2 x 16.5 cm). The Metropolitan Museum of Art, New York, Gift of Fred and Rita Richman, 1987 (1987.453.6)
Shahnama (Book of Kings) of Shah Tahmasp, ca. 1525–30. Opaque watercolor, ink, silver, and gold on paper. The Metropolitan Museum of Art, New York, Gift of Arthur A. Houghton Jr., 1970 (1970.301.1–78)

For a transcript of this episode and more information, visit metmuseum.org/immaterial

#MetImmaterial

Immaterial is produced by The Metropolitan Museum of Art and Magnificent Noise and hosted by Camile Dungy. This episode was produced by Adwoa Gyimah-Brempong.

Field production by Tanita Rahmani.

Special thanks to Sheila Blair, Lauren Johnson, and G. Willow Wilson.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Next Episode

Bonus Episode: Tarot

Grab a cup of tea and join us for a bonus episode on tarot. We learn about the cards from their patrician origins to the present day, when tarot is being used to subvert limiting tropes of gender and sexuality. A tarot deck begs some questions: what makes something art? And who decides? Some of the answers may surprise you. We meet the artists behind a queer, Southern, collective tarot deck, and hear from an educator at The Met how tarot can be a source of both beauty and resistance. Plus: Camille Dungy, host and tarot skeptic, gets a slightly apocalyptic reading from a fellow poet. Producers Adwoa Gyimah-Brempong and Eleanor Kagan take us behind the scenes: probing something that's not quite a material, but whose story is too dynamic not to share.

Guests:

Suhaly Bautista-Carolina, creator of Moon Mother Apothecary and senior managing educator of audience development, Education, The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Marco Leona, David H. Koch Scientist in Charge, Scientific Research, The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Allison Rudnick, associate curator, Drawings and Prints, The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Alexander Chee, poet, author, and professor of English and creative writing, Dartmouth College
Camille Dungy, poet and host of Immaterial

Slow Holler Tarot Artists:

JB Brager
Corina Dross
Miranda Javid
Nic Jenkins

Objects mentioned in this episode:

Niki de Saint-Phalle (American, 1930–2004). Niki de Saint Phalle tarot cards, 2002. 22 cards: illustrations ; Height: 5 1/2 in. (14 cm) ; Width: 3 1/8 in. (8 cm) + 1 booklet (48 unnumbered pages ; Height: 5 1/2 in. (14 cm)). The Metropolitan Museum of Art, New York (N6853.S255 S25 2002)

For a transcript of this episode and more information, visit metmuseum.org/immaterial

#MetImmaterial

Immaterial is produced by The Metropolitan Museum of Art and Magnificent Noise. This episode was produced by Adwoa Gyimah-Brempong and Eleanor Kagan.

Special thanks to Holly Phillips, Jessica Ranne-Cardona, Maria Schurr, E. Henderson, and Rachel Pollack.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.