Fixing the Disconnect Between Marketing and Sales with Talya Heller

05/15/25 • 41 min

#246 Sales Alignment | Danielle welcomes Talya Heller, founder of Down to a T, a B2B consultancy helping marketers turn competitive positioning into high-impact sales assets. With experience in engineering, product management, and product marketing, Talya knows how to bridge the gap between what marketing builds and what sales actually uses.

Together they unpack:

Why most sales decks and battle cards go unused and what to build instead
How to enable your champion to sell internally with confidence
Simple frameworks for mapping competitive positioning that teams will actually use

Talya also breaks down how she researches, builds, and delivers assets that align sales, marketing, and product, all rooted in buyer empathy.

Timestamps

(00:00) - – Intro & Talya’s background
(02:08) - – From engineering to B2B marketing
(08:53) - – What is buyer enablement?
(11:08) - – Why deals stall after vendor selection
(13:23) - – The problem with sales decks
(15:53) - – Why battle cards don’t work
(18:08) - – Talya’s competitive positioning map
(24:19) - – Grouping competitors by approach
(26:49) - – Market maps for sales
(28:49) - – Where to get the best insights
(31:19) - – New formats for enablement
(33:34) - – Why context matters
(35:19) - – Empathy for your sales team
(37:04) - – Closing thoughts on empathy
(38:09) - – Where to find Talya online

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***

Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.

Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.

It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.

But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.

That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.

Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.
Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.
Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.

And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.

See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.

***

Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.

They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.
Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.
Visit hatch.fm to learn more

Together they unpack:

Why most sales decks and battle cards go unused and what to build instead
How to enable your champion to sell internally with confidence
Simple frameworks for mapping competitive positioning that teams will actually use

Talya also breaks down how she researches, builds, and delivers assets that align sales, marketing, and product, all rooted in buyer empathy.

Timestamps

(00:00) - – Intro & Talya’s background
(02:08) - – From engineering to B2B marketing
(08:53) - – What is buyer enablement?
(11:08) - – Why deals stall after vendor selection
(13:23) - – The problem with sales decks
(15:53) - – Why battle cards don’t work
(18:08) - – Talya’s competitive positioning map
(24:19) - – Grouping competitors by approach
(26:49) - – Market maps for sales
(28:49) - – Where to get the best insights
(31:19) - – New formats for enablement
(33:34) - – Why context matters
(35:19) - – Empathy for your sales team
(37:04) - – Closing thoughts on empathy
(38:09) - – Where to find Talya online

***

Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.

Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.

It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.

That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.

Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.
Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.
Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.

And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.

See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.

***

Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.

They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.
Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.
Visit hatch.fm to learn more

Previous Episode

B2B Outbound Best Practices: What’s Working Now with Cold Email and Paid Ads (with Alex Fine)

#245: Cold Email | Danielle Messler sits down with Alex Fine, co-founder of Understory, the agency behind some of the most effective outbound and paid strategies in B2B right now. Alex is leading the charge on a smarter approach to outbound called “Allbound”, a tightly integrated blend of outbound, paid media, and LinkedIn tactics that actually convert.

If you’re tired of cold emails that go nowhere or ad campaigns that burn cash without ROI, this one’s for you.

Danielle and Alex cover:

Why most B2B outbound strategies fail and how Allbound fixes the disconnect between ads, email, and LinkedIn
The cold email deliverability tactics that actually work in 2025 (including tools like Instantly, Smartlead, and Clay)
Real-world examples of hyper-personalized, AI-powered outreach that book meetings with high-ACV prospects

Timestamps

(00:00) - – Intro
(03:08) - – What Is “Allbound”?
(05:08) - – Cold Email Isn’t Dead (But It’s Evolved)
(07:38) - – Tools to Improve Deliverability
(09:53) - – Personalization That Actually Works
(11:23) - – Real Example: Fraud Detection SaaS Cold Email Strategy
(13:08) - – How to Keep Messaging Consistent Across Channels
(15:08) - – Treating Each Channel Differently
(18:19) - – Ads as a “Cheat Code” in B2B
(20:49) - – Building Genuinely Personalized Emails at Scale
(23:49) - – From Swiffer to SaaS
(27:19) - – What Sales Teaches Marketers
(36:04) - – Where to Find Alex + Upcoming Exit Five Event Plug

***

Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.

Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.

It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.

That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.

Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.
Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.
Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.

And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.

See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.

***

Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.

They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.
Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.
Visit hatch.fm to learn more

Next Episode

The Lead Nurture Email Playbook: What Works and What Doesn’t

#247 Lead Nurturing | In this episode, Danielle is joined by Samar Owais, founder of Emails Done Right; Sheri Otto, CEO of Growth Lane Strategies; and Sofia Silva, Marketing Manager at Reachdesk.

These three email experts came together for a live roast of real B2B lead nurture emails, submitted by marketers from the Exit Five community. You’ll hear the good, the bad, and the fixable, with practical insights on how to improve your own nurture sequences.

Danielle, Samar, Sheri, and Sofia cover:

The most common lead nurture mistakes B2B marketers make (and how to fix them)
Why every email should be treated as a conversation, not just a campaign
How to write nurture emails that create connection, not clicks for clicks’ sake

If you're building (or rebuilding) your nurture strategy, this one’s packed with real examples and expert feedback to guide your next send.

Timestamps

(00:00) - – Intro: Welcome to the Lead Nurture Roast
(02:36) - – Meet the Experts: Samar, Sheri, and Sofia
(06:33) - – What Is **Lead Nurturing, Really?
(09:26) - – The Problem with “We” Language in Emails
(11:48) - – The Biggest Mistakes B2B Marketers Make
(14:13) - – Why AI Isn’t Your Copywriter
(16:08) - – Teardown #1: Subject Line Gone Wrong
(20:38) - – How to Build a Nurture Sequence Around a Whitepaper
(23:18) - – CTA Overload and Why It Kills Clicks
(28:23) - – Teardown #2: Great Open Rate, Low Engagement
(32:17) - – The One-CTA Rule (And Why It Matters)
(34:59) - – Structuring Long Emails for Skimmability
(37:31) - – Teardown #3: Cold Lead, Wrong Email
(40:04) - – Re-Engagement Emails That Actually Work
(42:54) - – Use Social Proof Instead of Product Pitches
(44:34) - – Teardown #4: The Overloaded Onboarding Email
(47:29) - – What’s a “Micro Conversion” in SaaS Email?
(52:04) - – Time-to-Value and the First Action That Matters
(54:19) - – This Email Is... a Whole Sequence in One
(56:39) - – Teardown #5: Trust Email or Generic Spam?
(59:34) - – Why Specificity Beats Industry Buzzwords
(01:01:49) - – Final Scores and Wrap-Up

***

Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.

Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.

It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.

That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.

Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.
Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.
Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.

And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.

See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.

***

Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.

They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.
Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.
Visit hatch.fm to learn more