Valley of Depth
Payload | Ignition | Tectonic
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Top 10 Valley of Depth Episodes
Goodpods has curated a list of the 10 best Valley of Depth episodes, ranked by the number of listens and likes each episode have garnered from our listeners. If you are listening to Valley of Depth for the first time, there's no better place to start than with one of these standout episodes. If you are a fan of the show, vote for your favorite Valley of Depth episode by adding your comments to the episode page.
Creating Constellations, with Tim Kienberger (LeoStella)
Valley of Depth
01/16/24 • 45 min
Our guest this week, Tim Kienberger, has been at the forefront of the industry's evolution from large-scale satellite buses to the small satellite revolution. As the current CEO of LeoStella, a joint venture between Thales Alenia Space and BlackSky, he is helping the company redefine small satellite manufacturing.
In today's episode, Tim reveals insights into the production of small satellites and the unique challenges of managing a joint venture. In addition, we discuss:
- LeoStella’s origin story
- Cislunar spacecraft needs
- The impact of Starship on small satellites
- Scaling challenges of small sat startups
And much more...
• Chapters •
00:00 - Introduction
00:22 - Tim's career overview
02:40 - Thales/Blacksky JV
06:56 - Core offerings and customer makeup
09:01 - Current demand
12:19 - Product roadmap
14:03 - Capability needs from LEO to cislunar
17:53 - Government customers
19:50 - Balancing customization vs standardization
23:18 - Production hurdles
26:16 - Competitive landscape
27:36 - Challenges for new startups
31:32 - Impact of Starship on the small sat market
40:18 - Long-term funding needs
42:19 - What would Tim be doing if he wasn't in the space industry
• Show notes •
LeoStella's website — https://leostella.com/
LeoStella's socials — https://twitter.com/LeoStellaLLC
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers.
Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)
Global Connectivity, with Chris Taylor (Aalyria)
Valley of Depth
05/07/24 • 54 min
This week’s Pathfinder features Chris Taylor, CEO and founder of Aalyria, a Google spinout that specializes in advanced connectivity solutions. The company is developing what could be game changing free-space optics hardware and network orchestration software to meaningfully change communication speed and efficiency across air, space, land, and sea. It’s core products include:
- Tightbeam: An advanced free-space optics technology which uses coherent light (laser technology) to transmit data at high speeds over long distances without physical connections like cables.
- Spacetime: A SaaS platform that serves as a network management system that can control and direct data flows across different types of infrastructure, including satellites, ground stations, and other communication devices, effectively making each component a node in a larger network (think: traffic controller for communications).
In this episode, we dissect:
- Free space optics 101
- Aalyria’s origins as a Google spinout
- Deep dive on core technologies and challenges
- Strategic commercial applications
• Chapters •
00:00 Intro
00:32 Chris's path to Aalyria
02:15 What is Aalyria building?
04:52 How do different space assets communicate with each other today?
05:59 What is optical communication?
07:58 The coherent light free space optics (FSO) program
10:50 Why did Google sell their optical comms tech?
12:56 Why is this so important?
15:15 Benefits of Tightbeam over existing free space optics, coherent vs non-coherent space optics
21:22 Customer profiles
25:41 Real-world use case
28:02 Use case in autonomous fleet navigation
29:44 Fleet of autonomous taxis
30:53 Size of Aalyria's addressable market
35:34 Commercialization prospects
38:32 Work with DIU (Defense Innovation Unit)
40:01 Competitors
42:25 Limits of technology
44:22 Funding
47:00 10-year vision
50:34 What does Chris do for fun?
• Show notes •
Aalyria’s website — https://www.aalyria.com/
Aalyria’s socials — https://twitter.com/AalyriaTech
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 19,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world.
Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing five media properties across multiple platforms:
1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern
2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com)
3) Polaris, our weekly policy briefing, publishes weekly on Tuesdays
4) Payload Research, our weekly research and analysis piece, comes out on Wednesdays
You can sign up for all of our publications here: https://payloadspace.com/subscribe/
The Blue Ghost, with Ray Allensworth (Firefly)
Valley of Depth
06/11/24 • 47 min
This week on Pathfinder, we're joined by Ray Allensworth, Spacecraft Program Director at Firefly Aerospace. Ray, who has a previous background with major aerospace names like Raytheon and Northrop, helps lead Blue Ghost, Firefly’s lunar lander program designed to deliver scientific and commercial payloads to the surface of the Moon. The company is currently on track to be the next commercial lunar lander on the Moon with its planned launch in November aiming for the elusive 100% flawless mission which has not yet been achieved by any commercial entity.
Our conversation delves into the comprehensive capabilities of Firefly as an end-to-end space transportation company, the intricacies of the Blue Ghost program, and the significance of lunar exploration. We also explore:
- The origins and objectives of Blue Ghost
- Technical milestones and challenges
- The economic and strategic importance of lunar landers
- The role of Firefly in the broader context of NASA's Artemis program
- Future missions and the commercial opportunity on the moon
And much more...
• Chapters •
00:00 Intro
00:37 Firefly overview
01:27 Blue Ghost
03:02 How Ray got to Firefly and her background
04:22 Building a space company in Texas
05:18 What is the importance of returning to the moon?
07:01 National security interest in the Moon
08:20 Viability of developing products for the Moon
09:50 Current moon landing customers and where Ray sees growth
11:04 Commercial Lunar Payload Services (CLPS) Program
12:26 Most promising commercial opportunity on the Moon
14:43 Why is it still so hard to land on the Moon?
16:58 How is the Blue Ghost Architecture different from other lunar landers?
19:54 Technical milestones, team, and launch for Blue Ghost
21:01 Most important challenges to overcome for Mission 1
23:04 Powering beyond solar
23:54 Testing for the lunar environment
28:29 What risks keep Ray up at night?
29:52 Customer goals for Mission 1
31:20 The international market
35:44 Commercial landing on the dark side of the Moon
36:53 What's next after CLPS?
37:47 Blue Ghost profitability
39:58 Firefly's role in Artemis program
41:37 Is sample return in the future plan?
42:03 Press bomb prep
43:17 Is the Moon your calling?
44:54 What would you send to the Moon?
46:22 Ray's favorite place to eat in Texas
• Show notes •
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Firefly’s Blue Ghost website — https://fireflyspace.com/blue-ghost/
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 19,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world.
Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing five media properties across multiple platforms:
1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern
2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com)
3) Polaris, our weekly policy briefing, publishes weekly on Tuesdays
4) Payload Research, our weekly research and analysis piece, comes out on Wednesdays
You can sign up for all of our publications here: https://payloadspace.com/subscribe/
Next Gen Space Infrastructure, with Clay Mowry (Voyager)
Valley of Depth
09/05/23 • 57 min
The clock is ticking on Voyager’s aspirations in LEO.
In 2021, the Denver-based space exploration company announced its goal to launch a commercial space station by 2028, three years ahead of the ISS retirement. Clay Mowry, the chief revenue officer of Voyager Space and one of the driving forces behind that vision, joins Pathfinder this week to dive into the company’s plans to build infrastructure in Earth orbit.
The LEO significance: With the ISS bowing out, LEO-based ventures like Voyager’s Starlab are poised to fill a gap in LEO, though they aren’t the only ones chasing that goal. Other companies like Axiom, Sierra Space, and Northrop are working in partnership with NASA to capture the billions of dollars spent on the ISS every year.
The focus of Starlab, which is partially funded by a $160M space act agreement with NASA, will be on research applications, rather than tourism. The station is designed to fit on a single launch, outfitted on the ground with all the research equipment needed for its customers. It’s expected to be able to hold four people and will be used to conduct scientific research.
The company recently announced a collaboration with Airbus Defense and Space. The international joint venture will be based out of the US, but features a European arm focused on serving the European Space Agency (ESA) and its member space agencies.
A sneak peak...
Before taking up the role of CRO in January 2022, Mowry made instrumental contributions at Blue Origin and oversaw operations at Arianespace, Inc. Beyond Voyager, Mowry's influence extends to the International Astronautical Federation, an international non-governmental organization (NGO) that was founded in 1951 to promote the peaceful use of space. In addition to Voyager’s future, we chat:
- Clay’s time at Arianespace and Blue Origin
- Why Starlab is critical to our future in space
- The partnership with Airbus
- Cultural changes in the space industry
- The IAF and its mission
- And much more...
This episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/
• Chapters •
00:00 - Intro & SpiderOak Ad
02:19 - Clay's background and interest in space
07:20 - From Arianespace to Blue Origin
11:27 - The first New Shepard Auction
14:08 - Role as CRO at Voyager
16:08 - Is Voyager a holding company?
16:48 - Brief background on Dylan Taylor
18:45 - Who convinced Clay to join Voyager?
20:08 - What is Starlab?
28:20 - Partnership with Airbus
31:21 - SpiderOak Ad
32:09 - The case for private space stations
40:19 - How heavy launch will change mass and design constraints for the industry
43:06 - Competitive landscape
46:06 - What is the IAF?
49:33 - Biggest cultural changes in space
51:17 - When do you think New Glenn will fly?
• Show notes •
Voyager's website — https://voyagerspace.com/
Clay's socials — https://twitter.com/claymowry
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers.
Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)
Mining Asteroids, with Matt Gialich (AstroForge)
Valley of Depth
07/11/23 • 54 min
Today’s Pathfinder episode features AstroForge cofounder and CEO Matt Gialich. The CA-based startup is developing technology to mine asteroids for platinum group metals. The company plans to use an uncrewed spacecraft to extract and refine the metals directly on the asteroid before returning to Earth with a sellable metal.
Why platinum? The platinum group metals have unique physical and chemical properties that make them critical to everything from catalytic converters to electronics. According to Gialich, the US has a dwindling supply of platinum group ore reserves, and Russia and China control a significant supply of global stocks. But there’s hope in the heavens: a single one-kilometer-diameter M-type (primarily composed of metallic iron and nickel) asteroid could contain more platinum than has been mined in the history of humanity, Gialich said.
So far...AstroForge launched a refinery demo this spring and plans to launch a prospecting mission in October where they will physically go to an asteroid to map and monitor the surface. Future missions will include excavation and finally mining.
A sneak peek...Mo and Matt discuss:
- The history of landing on asteroids
- The basics of asteroid mining
- The economics of mining off-planet
- Legal and regulatory considerations
And much more...
This episode is brought to you by SpiderOak, a US-based software company that builds space cybersecurity products and solutions for civilian, military, and commercial space operations. Learn more at https://spideroak.com/
• Chapters •
00:00 - Intro and SpiderOak ad
02:07 - The early days of AstroForge
02:51 - Why asteroid mining today?
06:58 - Cofounder backgrounds
08:14 - Asteroid mining 101
11:48 - Platinum group metals
13:10 - Historical asteroid missions
17:23 - Refining materials on an asteroid
20:51 - Upcoming mission
22:33 - How unique is AstroForge's technology?
24:48 - Mission risks
27:32 - SpiderOak ad break
28:19 - Economics of asteroid mining
33:59 - AstroForge's first mission
34:31 - Outlook for the next few missions
34:55 - Scaling plans after a successful first mission
37:22 - Capital intensity of the venture
39:42 - Team construction
41:12 - Competition
42:13 - Legal & regulatory considerations of mining
46:30 - 10-year vision
49:28 - Future technologies for easier asteroid mining
51:27 - Favorite space companies
• Show notes •
AstroForge's website — https://www.astroforge.io/
AstroForge's socials — https://twitter.com/astroforge
Matt's socials — https://twitter.com/MattGialich
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world. Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers.
Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms: 1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/) 2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com) 3) Polaris, our weekly policy publication, hits inboxes Tuesday (https://polaris.payloadspace.com/) 4) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)
Commodities & Tech of a Lunar Architecture, with Tim Cichan & Christie Iacomini (Lockheed Martin)
Valley of Depth
12/10/24 • 55 min
In the second episode of our special three-part Pathfinder series on lunar architecture—brought to you by our partners at Lockheed Martin—we’re zooming in on the technologies and design principles that will help establish a sustainable, long-term presence on the Moon and pave the way for future missions to Mars. Joining us are Christie Iacomini, who manages Lockheed Martin’s lunar infrastructure technology portfolio, and Tim Cichan, the company’s space exploration architect.
Christie and Tim walk us through the building blocks of lunar infrastructure, from robust power systems and reliable communications networks to habitats and mobility solutions. They also highlight the importance of resource utilization, the evolving role of public-private partnerships, and the collaborative efforts needed to turn ambitious concepts into practical solutions.
We discuss:
- The role of vertical solar arrays, nuclear fission systems, and power grids in supporting lunar operations
- Communications challenges and the roadmap for building an interoperable lunar network
- Innovative habitats and rovers designed to withstand extreme lunar conditions
- Strategies for in-situ resource utilization, including extracting water ice and other key materials
- The significance of international collaboration and commercial engagement in achieving lasting lunar sustainability
And much, much more...
• Chapters •
00:00 - Intro
03:45 - What is a space architect?
04:42 - Lockheed's goal for Mars
08:23 - Technological advancements that have made a long-term Moon mission possible
09:52 - What does a successful Lunar mission look like?
11:46 - Power systems for Lunar and Mars missions and state of development cycles
18:15 - Tech in Artemis II and III
20:04 - Challenges for creating a seamless communications network for the Moon
22:34 - Effect of modern tech in space
27:10 - Lunar mobility capabilities
30:44 - Habitation
33:14 - Inflatable vs modular habitats
34:20 - Lunar resource utilization
36:42 - How to create seamless integration between mission-critical tech
41:55 - Planned contingencies
43:49 - Seemingly futuristic technology
45:54 - Getting around on the Moon
47:48 - How Lockheed works with other companies building Lunar architecture
49:01 - Technical milestones
50:58 - What will it take to land on the Moon on time?
52:07 - Inspirations for your work
• Show notes •
Lockheed Martin’s website — https://www.lockheedmartin.com/en-us/capabilities/space/human-space-exploration/water-based-lunar-architecture/lockheed-martins-lunar-architecture-novella-white-paper.html
Lockheed Martin Space’ socials — https://twitter.com/LMSpace
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 19,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world.
Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing five media properties across multiple platforms:
1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern
2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com)
3) Polaris, our weekly policy briefing, publishes weekly on Tuesdays
4) Payload Research, our weekly research and analysis piece, comes out on Wednesdays
You can sign up for all of our publications here: https://payloadspace.com/subscribe/
Direct to Deployment, with Robert Sproles (CEO of Exolaunch)
Valley of Depth
11/11/24 • 54 min
This week on Pathfinder, we explore the world of satellite deployment and launch services with Robert Sproles, CEO of Exolaunch. Exolaunch is a leader in satellite integration, offering launch services and deployment solutions for commercial and government clients.
We explore how Exolaunch has built a cashflow-positive business with a remarkable track record of reliability, all without external funding. In addition, we discuss:
- Exolaunch's founding story and its bootstrapped growth from a university project in Berlin to a $100M revenue company
- How Exolaunch navigates partnerships with major launch providers like SpaceX, Rocket Lab, and Ariane
- Robert’s insights on the demand for satellite launches and the need for diversity in orbital access
- Exolaunch's plans for the future, including scaling to support larger satellites and expanding their U.S. operations
- The broader ecosystem of launch services and how larger rockets like Starship and New Glenn fit into the market
And much more...
• Chapters •
00:00 - Intro
00:30 - Robert's background
08:13 - What is Exolaunch and the products offered?
10:02 - Founding of Exolaunch and building a company without the need for raising capital
14:09 - Bootstrap from day one and future funding plans
16:35 - From Arkansas to Germany
19:02 - Robert transitioning to CEO
21:16 - Current market for rideshare, deployment, and mission management
23:45 - What is different about Exolaunch?
25:48 - Are more launch companies good for Exolaunch and is SpaceX a monopoly?
27:02 - Are transporter missions anti-competitive to other launch companies?
30:13 - Future satellite trends
31:42 - How larger launch vehicles affect Exolaunch
33:33 - Is the launch market supplier demand constrained?
35:35 - How do non-American operators feel about using American launch providers?
37:39 - What does reliability look like?
40:08 - Exolaunch's agility
43:34 - Missions that pushed the boundaries of Exolaunch's capabilities
45:36 - Exolaunch headcount and future plans
46:32 - Growth areas
47:37 - 10+ year outlook
49:07 - What does Robert do outside of Exolaunch?
52:26 - Places to eat in Little Rock, Arkansas
• Show notes •
Exolaunch’s website — https://exolaunch.com/
Freeform’s socials — https://twitter.com/Exolaunch
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 19,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world.
Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing five media properties across multiple platforms:
1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern
2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com)
3) Polaris, our weekly policy briefing, publishes weekly on Tuesdays
4) Payload Research, our weekly research and analysis piece, comes out on Wednesdays
You can sign up for all of our publications here: https://payloadspace.com/subscribe/
The State of Launch & OSAM (Payload Editorial)
Valley of Depth
04/02/24 • 41 min
Pathfinder is shaking things up for the next two weeks with a special pod series on the State of the Space Industry. In each episode, you’ll hear from two members of Payload’s editorial staff on key trends, exclusive interviews, and insights shaping the industry.
This week? Launch & OSAM, featuring Payload’s Managing Editor Jacqueline Feldscher and Senior Space Reporter Tim Fernholz. Highlights from the discussion include:
Launch
- Launch cadence + increasing demand
- Role of launch providers and competition
- Challenges including space debris and regulation
- Advancements in reusability
OSAM
- The OSAM chicken-and-egg problem
- The role of government partnerships and regulations
- Key technologies required for OSAM
- Recent developments and upcoming missions, including Northrop Grumman's MRV mission, Astroscale's ADRAS-J mission, and SpaceX's Starship refueling demonstrations
And much more...
This episode is brought to you by the Italian Trade Agency (ITA). Be sure to check out the Italian Pavilion in South Hall (Booth 603) during Space Symposium!
• Chapters •
00:00 - Intro & ITA Ad
01:35 - The state of launch in 2023
04:14 - Peter Beck & Rocket Lab
06:31 - Tory Bruno & ULA
11:43 - Tim Ellis & Relativity Space
14:09 - Make or break in launch
15:27 - Government’s perspective on launch outside SpaceX
17:46 - What Jacqueline is excited for in 2024
19:07 - Blue Origin & ULA
21:41 - Tim Fernholz!
22:28 - OSAM. What is it and what companies fall underneath the OSAM umbrella?
24:22 - Core capabilities
25:19 - OSAM market in 2023
25:59 - Challenges of building
27:10 - Gaps in technology
29:53 - Should startups be investing in OSAM technology?
32:21 - How integral is the government in developing OSAM?
34:13 - Who is setting standards?
35:42 - OSAM 1
37:56 - What Tim is excited for in 2024
• Show notes •
Jacqueline’s socials — https://twitter.com/jacqfeldscher
Tim’s socials — https://twitter.com/TimFernholz
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 19,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world.
Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing five media properties across multiple platforms:
1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern
2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com)
3) Polaris, our weekly policy briefing, publishes weekly on Tuesdays
4) Payload Research, our weekly research and analysis piece, comes out on Wednesdays
You can sign up for all of our publications here: https://payloadspace.com/subscribe/
The Future of Engineering, with Malory McLemore (Stell)
Valley of Depth
01/23/24 • 39 min
Our guest this week is Malory McLemore, the co-founder and CEO of Stell, an LA-based startup that is building workflow software to serve as the future data layer for hardware and industrials. Their platform enables complex, multi-company hardware development efforts to track engineering and compliance documentation, replacing traditional methods like Excel sheets and PDFs.
Malory shares her journey from being an aerospace engineer dealing with subpar software tooling to founding Stell. In addition, we discuss:
- Stell’s origin story and fundraising plans
- Differentiating engineering tools
- Apollo-era systems engineering
- The next generation of post-MBA graduates
And much more...
• Chapters •
00:00 - Intro
00:48 - What is Stell?
01:44 - Malory's career arc in the space industry
05:19 - Why are Harvard students becoming more interested in space?
06:37 - Malory's previous jobs that led her to Stell today
07:49 - How could aircraft like Boeing's latest be improved?
10:53 - How have companies operated in the past and why should they work with Stell?
12:38 - Current offerings and roadmap
14:19 - Stell's business model
14:55 - What does the ideal Stell customer look like?
15:50 - Stell's selling point
16:45 - How do you quantify money savings to a client
18:33 - Government clients
20:39 - How did Stella build the team
22:36 - Plans for expanding beyond aerospace
23:28 - How do you differentiate among other engineering management tools?
26:51 - Do you think that this looks from other companies, but we’re headed to start to look similar?
29:45 - Current fundraising plans
30:06 - Grand vision to investors
31:41 - What kicked off the growth of hard tech startups?
33:23 - What would Malory be working on if it weren't for Stell?
33:56 - Apollo-era management
37:26 - What does the startup community look like in Huntsville?
38:32 - Was building in LA the best decision you've made?
Stell's website — https://www.stell-engineering.com/
Stell's socials — https://twitter.com/stell_space
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 15,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world.
Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing three media properties across multiple platforms:
1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern (https://newsletter.payloadspace.com/)
2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com)
3) Parallax, our weekly space science briefing, hits inboxes Thursday (https://parallax.payloadspace.com/)
02/11/25 • 43 min
This week on Pathfinder, we’re joined by Jack Kuhr, Research Director at Payload, for a deep dive into one of the most closely watched companies in the space industry—SpaceX. We break down Payload’s latest analysis of SpaceX’s revenue, exploring how the company’s launch business and Starlink network are shaping its financial trajectory.
With our estimate of SpaceX’s 2024 revenue at $13.1 billion, this episode unpacks the numbers, key growth drivers, and what’s next. We also discuss:
- How Payload builds its SpaceX revenue model and refines estimates year after year
- The breakdown of SpaceX’s revenue across launch, Starlink, and other government contracts
- The rapid growth of Starlink—now at 4.6 million customers—and where the business is headed
- The future of Starship and its impact on Falcon 9, launch pricing, and industry competition
- Potential financial winners and losers when Starship becomes fully operational
- Speculative questions on SpaceX’s future, from a possible IPO to whether it can become the first trillion-dollar space company
And more...
• Chapters •
00:00 Intro
01:02 Jack's background
02:16 Constructing the SpaceX revenue estimates
06:17 How close our predictions were
08:01 Numbers rundown
10:02 SpaceX's percentage of global launch
10:45 SpaceX's price per launch
12:26 Does SpaceX need Starling to stay profitable?
13:55 When will Starship launch paying customers?
15:44 Starlink's next-gen satellites
18:19 Starlink's sub growth
20:38 Evolution of Starlink's pricing power
22:51 Where does SpaceX see the most growth?
25:12 Starlink's scalability and will it ever reach 50+ million customers?
29:03 SpaceX's other revenue generator
31:10 Will Starship make Falcon 9 obsolete?
32:37 Who loses when Starship becomes fully operational?
34:05 Will demand make up for the loss of cost per kilogram?
36:33 If SpaceX was a public company, how would investors react to these revenue figures?
39:19 Which SpaceX revenue stream could 10x?
41:03 Will SpaceX be the first trillion-dollar space company?
• Show notes •
Estimating SpaceX’s 2024 Revenue — https://payloadspace.com/estimating-spacexs-2024-revenue/
Jack’s socials — https://x.com/JackKuhr
Mo's socials — https://twitter.com/itsmoislam
Payload’s socials — https://twitter.com/payloadspace / https://www.linkedin.com/company/payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Watch: https://www.youtube.com/@payloadspace
Pathfinder archive — Listen: https://pod.payloadspace.com/episodes
• About us •
Pathfinder is brought to you by Payload, a modern space media brand built from the ground up for a new age of space exploration and commercialization. We deliver need-to-know news and insights daily to 19,000+ commercial, civil, and military space leaders. Payload is read by decision-makers at every leading new space company, along with c-suite leaders at all of the aerospace & defense primes. We’re also read on Capitol Hill, in the Pentagon, and at space agencies around the world.
Payload began as a weekly email sent to a few friends and coworkers. Today, we’re a team distributed across four time zones and two continents, publishing five media properties across multiple platforms:
1) Payload, our flagship daily newsletter, sends M-F @ 9am Eastern
2) Pathfinder publishes weekly on Tuesday mornings (pod.payloadspace.com)
3) Polaris, our weekly policy briefing, publishes weekly on Tuesdays
4) Payload Research, our weekly research and analysis piece, comes out on Wednesdays
You can sign up for all of our publications here: https://payloadspace.com/subscribe/
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Valley of Depth currently has 129 episodes available.
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