Profound - S4 E4 - Bill Bellows - Unraveling Complexity in Safety and Quality Part 2

S4 E4 - Bill Bellows - Unraveling Complexity in Safety and Quality Part 2

02/26/24 • 40 min

In part two of their discussion, John Willis engages in a deep dive with Bill Bellows on the multifaceted world of safety, quality, and systems thinking. Inspired by the pioneering work of Sydney Decker, Dr. Woods, and Erik Hollnagel, they explore the nuanced perspectives on safety and quality that transcend conventional understanding.

John and Bill navigate the intricate connections between thoroughness, efficiency, and effectiveness, drawing parallels to the foundational principles of Deming and Ackoff. They dissect the Efficiency-Thoroughness Trade-Off (ETTO) principle introduced by Hollnagel, pondering its implications in the context of operational safety and quality management.

The conversation further delves into Russ Ackoff’s insights on systems thinking, the DIKW (Data, Information, Knowledge, Wisdom) model, and the profound impact of understanding complex systems on improving organizational outcomes. Bill shares anecdotes from his experiences, illustrating the practical application of these concepts in real-world settings, including his work at Rocketdyne and with the Deming community.
Bill's LinkedIn can be found here:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/bill-bellows-218435/
Show Notes:
1) Ackoff videos on Deming Cooperative, https://demingcooperative.org/ackoffvideos/

2) Ackoff on DIKUW - article, https://faculty.ung.edu/kmelton/Documents/DataWisdom.pdf

3) Ackoff on DIKUW - video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzS5V5-0VsA&t=21s

3) Deming and Ackoff - excerpts of Volume 21 of the Deming Library, ("A Theory of a System for Educators and Managers”),https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MJ3lGJ4OFo

4) Deming and Ackoff - transcript of full recorded of Volume 21 of the Deming Library ,https://ackoffcenter.blogs.com/ackoff_center_weblog/2011/04/a-converstaion-between-russell-ackoff-and-edward-deming.html

5) Ackoff - Memories, https://www.amazon.com/Memories-Hardcover-Collectors-Russell-Ackoff/dp/0956537995

6) Ackoff - Differences That Make a Difference, https://www.amazon.com/Differences-that-Make-Difference-Distinctions/dp/1908009012/

2) Ackoff on DIKUW - article, https://faculty.ung.edu/kmelton/Documents/DataWisdom.pdf

3) Ackoff on DIKUW - video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzS5V5-0VsA&t=21s

3) Deming and Ackoff - excerpts of Volume 21 of the Deming Library, ("A Theory of a System for Educators and Managers”),https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MJ3lGJ4OFo

5) Ackoff - Memories, https://www.amazon.com/Memories-Hardcover-Collectors-Russell-Ackoff/dp/0956537995

6) Ackoff - Differences That Make a Difference, https://www.amazon.com/Differences-that-Make-Difference-Distinctions/dp/1908009012/

Previous Episode

S4 E3 - Bill Bellows - Navigating Organizations Through a Systems Lens Part 1

In this episode, I sit down once again with Bill Bellows to explore the interconnected nature of quality thinking. Our conversation ventures beyond traditional boundaries, drawing on Bill's unique insights into systemic thinking and its implications for organizational excellence.

We delve into the philosophy of interconnectedness, illustrating how quality extends far beyond the superficial, embedding itself into every facet of production and service. Bill shares enlightening perspectives on the importance of viewing organizations as whole systems, where every element is interrelated and changes in one part can ripple through others.
Bill's LinkedIn can be found here:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/bill-bellows-218435/
Show Notes:
1) Ackoff videos on Deming Cooperative, https://demingcooperative.org/ackoffvideos/

2) Ackoff on DIKUW - article, https://faculty.ung.edu/kmelton/Documents/DataWisdom.pdf

3) Ackoff on DIKUW - video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzS5V5-0VsA&t=21s

3) Deming and Ackoff - excerpts of Volume 21 of the Deming Library, ("A Theory of a System for Educators and Managers”),https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MJ3lGJ4OFo

5) Ackoff - Memories, https://www.amazon.com/Memories-Hardcover-Collectors-Russell-Ackoff/dp/0956537995

6) Ackoff - Differences That Make a Difference, https://www.amazon.com/Differences-that-Make-Difference-Distinctions/dp/1908009012/

Next Episode

S4 E5 - Richard Steele - Navigating Cultural Shifts with Deming's Philosophy

In this episode of the Profound Podcast, I engage in an insightful conversation with Richard Steele, founder and president of Peeker Services. We explore his journey from rebuilding locomotives to embracing W. Edwards Deming's principles, leading to a radical change in his company's management practices, particularly around performance appraisals and bonus systems. Steele shares transformative moments, like presenting his new pay program to the Detroit Deming study group, including Dr. Deming himself, and the eventual transition of his company into an employee-owned structure. The dialogue delves into the practical applications of Deming's theories in the workplace, the power of collective problem-solving, and the importance of fostering a culture of learning and adaptation. Finally, we take a look at some of Dick's critiques of Deming's Journey to Profound Knowledge.

Steele's narrative demonstrates a successful integration of system thinking and the profound impact of shifting from traditional merit pay to a more inclusive and equitable model, redefining quality and performance metrics within his organization.
Richard's LinkedIn can be found here:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-steele-6586477/