Building a Software Company and Saying 'No' to Millions with Jason Fried.

05/31/24 • 68 min

In world where we’re constantly encouraged to want more, how do you find the courage to say no?

Founder and CEO of 37signals (makers of Basecamp, HEY, and ONCE) Jason Fried joins the podcast for a wide-ranging conversation covering software products and services, saying ‘no’ to millions, learning drums, and more. Jason shares his unique perspectives on building and running a hugely successful software company while staying true to his values.

Join us as we explore Jason's story and learn about:

The motivation behind Basecamp's recent expansion into new products like email and calendar apps
How Jason and his co-founder have structured the company to maximize independence and avoid things they don't want to do
Thoughts on wealth and what he plans to do with the financial success of Basecamp
Current interests and passions outside of work, and what he would do if he couldn't run Basecamp anymore
Books and favorite products

Whether you're a tech entrepreneur or simply fascinated by the career of one of the industry's most unconventional and opinionated leaders, Jason's experiences and philosophies are sure to challenge and inspire you. Tune in for an honest and spontaneous discussion touching on the deepest questions in life and business.

Resources Mentioned

Drumeo
Decent Espresso Machine
1978 Porsche 928
Books: The Old Man and the Sea, The Overstory, Rabbit is Rich
Hey Calendar
Once
Campfire

‍

Chapters

00:00 - Introduction
2:20 - Inspiration Behind Hey Calendar
3:47 - Fantastical vs. Hey Calendar
4:55 - What Keeps Jason Going
7:24 - Why Hey Calendar Caps at $99
9:09 - Jason’s Commitment to Independence
12:59 - Limits to Improvement and Acceptance
15:56 - Jason’s Plans on Growing His Business
19:12 - Learning to Trust CEO Hires
20:59 - Why Jason Decided to Build New Products After 10 Years
24:21 - Changing Your Mind & Balancing Growth and Maintenance
28:06 - Keeping Businesses Simple
32:20 - What Jason Does With His Money
36:28 - The Courage to Close A Business
39:42 - The Burden of Wealth: Philanthropy and Responsibility
42:43 - Finding Joy in Spaces and Experiences
45:11 - Alternate Career Paths Jason is Drawn To
48:01 - The Future and Existential Worries
52:56 - Growing Old, the Younger Generation, and Life
59:27 - Things Jason Has Been Loving Lately
62:49 - Embracing Fiction: The Power of Storytelling

🔗 Connect with Jason:

Twitter/X: @jasonfried
LinkedIn: @jason-fried
37signals: https://37signals.com/
🔗 Connect with Andrew:
Twitter/X: @awilkinson (exclusive monthly AMAs for subscribers)
LinkedIn: @awilkinson
Website: https://www.neverenough.com/
Sign up for Andrew's weekly newsletter

In world where we’re constantly encouraged to want more, how do you find the courage to say no?

Join us as we explore Jason's story and learn about:

The motivation behind Basecamp's recent expansion into new products like email and calendar apps
How Jason and his co-founder have structured the company to maximize independence and avoid things they don't want to do
Thoughts on wealth and what he plans to do with the financial success of Basecamp
Current interests and passions outside of work, and what he would do if he couldn't run Basecamp anymore
Books and favorite products

Resources Mentioned

Drumeo
Decent Espresso Machine
1978 Porsche 928
Books: The Old Man and the Sea, The Overstory, Rabbit is Rich
Hey Calendar
Once
Campfire

‍

Chapters

🔗 Connect with Jason:

Previous Episode

From Architecture to Headhunting, A Million-Dollar Exit Story with Marshall Haas

Marshall Haas is the Co-founder of Shepherd (now Somewhere), who recently sold a majority stake in his company. Watch as we dive into the incredible journey from architecture to headhunting, leading to a million-dollar exit.

Marshall offers valuable insights from his diverse ventures, including selling iPhone cases, running an Airbnb business, and building Shepherd. He discusses the challenges of growing a company, working with influential partners, and the emotional aspects of selling a business.

Chapters
00:45 - Introducing Marshall Haas: From Architecture to Entrepreneurship
00:57 - Entrepreneurship Journey: First Businesses to E-Commerce Success
03:51 - Diving into Real Estate: The Airbnb Experiment
04:57 - Headhunting and Starting Shepherd
10:11 - Selling Shepherd Behind The Scenes
15:50 - What’s Next?
20:29 - Building a New Home
22:03 - Life After the Big Deal
23:49 - Finding Purpose Beyond Wealth
24:34 - Exploring Hobbies and Building New Connections
27:09 - The Power of Time Tracking and Delegation
28:39 - Books That Shape a Business Mindset
32:40 - Innovative Health and Productivity Hacks
33:36 - The Joy of Delegating Leadership
35:15 - Business Ideas and Future Ventures
41:10 - Essential Tools for Productivity and Creativity
42:37 - Exploring New Career Paths

🔗 Connect with Marshall:
Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/marshal
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/marshallhaas/
Website: https://www.needwant.com
Website: https://www.somewhere.com/

🔗 Connect with Andrew:
Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/awilkinson (exclusive monthly AMAs for subscribers)
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/awilkinson/
Website: https://www.neverenough.com/
Weekly recommendations: https://bit.ly/4bT6IRv

Next Episode

From Party Boy to Millionaire Bestselling Author: Mark Manson on the Business of Books

Most known for his book The Subtle Art Of Not Giving A F*ck, Mark Manson is a three-time #1 NY Times bestselling author and entrepreneur. In this episode, he tackles questions, less about his books, and more about the business of being a writer. Can authors really make a living? Is the pursuit of fame and fortune really as glamorous as it seems? Mark also reveals what it’s like working in Hollywood, explaining why he believes the creator economy offers a brighter future.
Join us as we explore Mark's story and learn about:

The business of the publishing industry
Literature’s place in current society
Hollywood’s inefficiency and the future of the creator economy
The impact that fame and wealth has on people and relationships
Mark’s current struggles as well as what he’s looking forward to in the future

Craving honesty over hype? Mark gives you the unvarnished truth. Don’t miss this candid discussion about his journey from broke blogger to bestselling author, the challenges of working with Hollywood, and the surprising lessons learned from achieving everything he ever wished for.
Resources Mentioned

The Subtle Art of Not Giving A F*ck by Mark Manson
Old Man in The Sea by Ernest Hemingway
The Year of Magical Thinking by Joan Didion
Hemingway by Ken Burns & Lynn Novick
War and Peace by Leo Tolstoy
All The Light You Cannot See by Anthony Doerr
Garmin watch
Chapters

00:00 Intro
0:34 Can You Make Money As A Writer?
2:23 Should You Become An Author?
3:25 Is Mark More of An Author or an Entrepreneur?
4:40 Mark’s Journey to Wealth
7:04 Wealth’s Impact on Life and Relationships
12:10 Achieving Your Dreams Isn’t As Great As It Seems
15:17 Is Mark Done With Money?
16:42 Mark’s New Aspirations
18:31 Fame’s Impact on Mark’s Life
18:54 Mark’s Team
20:10 Mark on Managing His Team
21:23 Are Books Still Relevant Today?
23:12 Protecting Mental Health While Working in Social Media
24:16 The Advantages of Social Media
26:03 Mark’s Experience Making A Film
30:13 The Creator Economy is the Future
30:51 What Mark’s Does With His Money
31:46 Changing Social Circles & Finance Bros
36:55 Writers & Books Mark Loves
39:57 Mark’s Current Source of Stress
41:23 Mark’s Favorite Products
42:56 Mark’s Role Models
43:38 What Mark’s Excited About
🔗 Connect with Mark:

Twitter: @IAmMarkManson
Instagram: @markmanson
LinkedIn: @markmanson
Tiktok: @IAmMarkManson
Youtube: @IAmMarkManson
Website: https://markmanson.net
🔗 Connect with Andrew:

Twitter/X: @awilkinson
LinkedIn: @awilkinson
Website: https://www.neverenough.com/
Sign up for Andrew's newsletter