#22 Aging will be cured within 20 years — here's why | Prof. Derya Unutmaz

04/29/25 • 112 min

Lately, there's been growing pushback against the idea that AI will transform geroscience in the short term.

When Nobel laureate Demis Hassabis told 60 Minutes that AI could help cure every disease within 5–10 years, many in the longevity and biotech communities scoffed. Leading aging biologists called it wishful thinking - or outright fantasy.

They argue that we still lack crucial biological data to train AI models, and that experiments and clinical trials move too slowly to change the timeline.

Our guest in this episode, Professor Derya Unutmaz, knows these objections well. But he’s firmly on Team Hassabis.

In fact, Unutmaz goes even further. He says we won’t just cure diseases - we'll solve aging itself within the next 20 years.

And best of all, he offers a surprisingly detailed, concrete explanation of how it will happen:

building virtual cells, modeling entire biological systems *in silico*, and dramatically accelerating drug discovery — powered by next-generation AI reasoning engines.

🧬 In this wide-ranging conversation, we also cover:

✅ Why biological complexity is no longer an unsolvable barrier.

✅ How digital twins could revolutionize diagnosis and treatment.

✅ Why clinical trials as we know them may soon collapse.

✅ The accelerating timeline toward longevity escape velocity.

✅ How reasoning AIs (like GPT-4o, o1, DeepSeek) are changing scientific research.

✅ Whether AI creativity challenges the idea that only biological minds can create.

✅ Why AI will force a new culture of leisure, curiosity, and human flourishing.

✅ The existential stress that will come as AI outperforms human expertise.

✅ Why “Don’t die” is no longer a joke — it's real advice.

🎙️ Hosted - as always - by Peter Ottsjö (tech journalist and author of Evigt Ung) and Dr. Patrick Linden (philosopher and author of The Case Against Death).

🚀 Special offer for our LEVITY audience: Join Vitalism today and receive a 30% discount on your membership using the code LEVITY at checkout. https://www.vitalism.io/membership

🚀 Show notes for this episode will be available soon after this airs. Sign up for the LEVITY newsletter to get them straight to your inbox: reachlevity.com

-- CHAPTERS --

00:00 Introduction to Derya Unutmaz

05:22 Derya’s work at Jackson Laboratory

09:37 The impact of AI on research

15:04 AI as a collaborative partner

20:50 The nature of creativity in AI

30:21 Predictions for the future of AI and humanity

37:46 The future of AI in medicine

44:35 The impact of AI on professional identity

47:45 Education in the age of AI

01:01:32 The ethics of AI development

01:14:46 Longevity and AI's role in accelerating science

01:20:55 Virtual cells and digital twins

01:29:02 Can we do it in silico all the way?

01:33:08 Derya and Patrick will both talk at Vitalist Bay

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Lately, there's been growing pushback against the idea that AI will transform geroscience in the short term.

They argue that we still lack crucial biological data to train AI models, and that experiments and clinical trials move too slowly to change the timeline.

Our guest in this episode, Professor Derya Unutmaz, knows these objections well. But he’s firmly on Team Hassabis.

In fact, Unutmaz goes even further. He says we won’t just cure diseases - we'll solve aging itself within the next 20 years.

And best of all, he offers a surprisingly detailed, concrete explanation of how it will happen:

building virtual cells, modeling entire biological systems *in silico*, and dramatically accelerating drug discovery — powered by next-generation AI reasoning engines.

🧬 In this wide-ranging conversation, we also cover:

✅ Why biological complexity is no longer an unsolvable barrier.

✅ How digital twins could revolutionize diagnosis and treatment.

✅ Why clinical trials as we know them may soon collapse.

✅ The accelerating timeline toward longevity escape velocity.

✅ How reasoning AIs (like GPT-4o, o1, DeepSeek) are changing scientific research.

✅ Whether AI creativity challenges the idea that only biological minds can create.

✅ Why AI will force a new culture of leisure, curiosity, and human flourishing.

✅ The existential stress that will come as AI outperforms human expertise.

✅ Why “Don’t die” is no longer a joke — it's real advice.

🎙️ Hosted - as always - by Peter Ottsjö (tech journalist and author of Evigt Ung) and Dr. Patrick Linden (philosopher and author of The Case Against Death).

🚀 Special offer for our LEVITY audience: Join Vitalism today and receive a 30% discount on your membership using the code LEVITY at checkout. https://www.vitalism.io/membership

🚀 Show notes for this episode will be available soon after this airs. Sign up for the LEVITY newsletter to get them straight to your inbox: reachlevity.com

-- CHAPTERS --

00:00 Introduction to Derya Unutmaz

05:22 Derya’s work at Jackson Laboratory

09:37 The impact of AI on research

15:04 AI as a collaborative partner

20:50 The nature of creativity in AI

30:21 Predictions for the future of AI and humanity

37:46 The future of AI in medicine

44:35 The impact of AI on professional identity

47:45 Education in the age of AI

01:01:32 The ethics of AI development

01:14:46 Longevity and AI's role in accelerating science

01:20:55 Virtual cells and digital twins

01:29:02 Can we do it in silico all the way?

01:33:08 Derya and Patrick will both talk at Vitalist Bay

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Previous Episode

#21 A Physicist's Controversial Take on Why Age Reversal Will Never Work | Peter Fedichev

Peter Fedichev is a visionary scientist, biotech entrepreneur, and physicist at the forefront of longevity research. With a background in theoretical physics, he has seamlessly merged cutting-edge science with real-world applications, making groundbreaking contributions to the fields of aging, biotechnology, and artificial intelligence in healthcare. As the co-founder and CEO of Gero, a pioneering biotech company, Fedichev is revolutionizing our understanding of biological aging, using AI-driven approaches to uncover ways to extend human lifespan and combat age-related diseases. His work has been featured in leading scientific journals, and his insights are shaping the future of personalized medicine and longevity science. Driven by a relentless curiosity and a passion for pushing the boundaries of human potential, Fedichev is not just studying aging - he’s working to redefine it.

🚀 Special offer for our LEVITY audience: Join Vitalism today and receive a 30% discount on your membership using the code LEVITY at checkout. https://www.vitalism.io/membership

🚀 Show notes for this episode is available here: https://reachlevity.com/p/age-reversal-will-never-work-a-controversial-take-from-a-physicist-5935af91034fd123

-- EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS --

✅ The founding of Gero

✅ The physics of aging

✅ Why age reversal will not work

✅ What SENS gets right

✅ What SENS gets wrong

✅ AI and the longevity industry

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Next Episode

#23 Hilarious, brilliant and deadly serious: José Cordeiro's quest to defeat death

This is our first — and probably our last — episode where the guest has brought with him an actual punch card and proceeds to explain why it is, in fact, caca (which is Spanish for 💩, by the way).

Welcome to the wild world of José Cordeiro. Stick around and you might hear anecdotes about Robert Kennedy Jr. in Memphis 🎸, late-night karaoke sessions 🎤, and a man shouting “immortality!” to anyone and everyone. But behind the eccentric props and the shameless self-promotion (José didn’t just bring punch cards — he also brought his books 📚, his merch 👔, and his signature Death of Death tie — to the point where we had to clarify we’re not actually sponsored), there’s a deadly serious mission: José wants to end aging and defeat death.

A futurist, MIT-trained engineer, and bestselling author, José Cordeiro argues that humanity is on the brink of longevity escape velocity 🚀 — the moment when medical advances will start adding more years to our lives than time takes away. In this episode, we explore his bold predictions, from reversing aging by 2045 to launching a global “war on aging.” We cover the science 🔬, the politics 🏛️, the money 💰, and the wild optimism driving the longevity movement — with cryonics ❄️, Martians 👽, and €10 immortality claims all making appearances.

This might be our strangest — and most fascinating — conversation yet. Buckle up.

-- IN THIS EPISODE YOU'LL LEARN ABOUT --

✅ Why longevity escape velocity may be closer than we think

✅ How AI will aid longevity

✅ Why technological optimism is rational

✅ How the Covid pandemic was a relatively minor pandemic

✅ How the concept of work will change

✅ What the future of energy may be

✅ A personal history of Marvin Minsky, Ray Kurzweil and José Cordeiro

✅ Where to meet Cordeiro and demonstrate against aging

✅ Why immortality is probable by 2045

🚀 Special offer for our LEVITY audience: Join Vitalism today and receive a 30% discount on your membership using the code LEVITY at checkout. https://www.vitalism.io/membership

🚀 Show notes for this episode will be available soon after this airs. Sign up for the LEVITY newsletter to get them straight to your inbox: reachlevity.com

-- CHAPTERS --

00:00 Introduction

05:33 Cordeiro's struggle to end aging

12:28 Traveling the world to spread the word of The Death of Death

18:36 The small Covid Pandemic vs the huge aging pandemic

26:00 Scientific optimism

29:37 "Next time we meet we will be younger."

32:28 The concept of work through history

35:50 Exponentiality of progress - a personal history of computers

43:30 Kurzweil and Cordeiro mentored by Marvin Minsky

50:26 The future of energy

57:56 When will we reach LEV and what happens 2045?