Industry Relations
Rob Hahn and Greg Robertson
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Top 10 Industry Relations Episodes
Goodpods has curated a list of the 10 best Industry Relations episodes, ranked by the number of listens and likes each episode have garnered from our listeners. If you are listening to Industry Relations for the first time, there's no better place to start than with one of these standout episodes. If you are a fan of the show, vote for your favorite Industry Relations episode by adding your comments to the episode page.
Does the industry need so many REALTORS?
Industry Relations
01/17/24 • 56 min
Is this industry saturated with REALTORS? Will the part-time real estate agent fall by the wayside? Join Rob and Greg as they discuss industry evolution, challenges in obtaining accurate statistics, and the impact of part-time agents. They reflect on historical decisions, and propose solutions such as restricting REALTOR membership and implementing apprenticeship programs. Listen now to gain insights and thought-provoking solutions for the real estate industry!
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Industry Relations EP007: Greg Fischer Takes Us Back to the Future with NYC Brokers vs. Zillow
Industry Relations
03/16/17 • 43 min
Industry Relations EP007
Greg Fischer Takes Us Back to the Future with NYC Brokers vs. Zillow
We’re feeling a little déjà vu at Industry Relations as controversy brews between Zillow and brokers in NYC. Everything old is new again with the launch of the premier agent feature on leading real estate marketplace StreetEasy. For the last ten years, agents across the country have dealt with syndication – and it seems New York real estate’s time has come.
Today’s guest, Greg Fischer, serves as principal broker at Fred Real Estate Group in Bend, Oregon, and author of the blog Next in Housing. His unique background also includes work in the tech industry with real estate software companies Move, Inc. in San Francisco and Doorsteps in New York City. This makes him uniquely qualified to discuss the bruhaha as NYC brokers decide whether to pay the Zillow tax or boycott it.
**Audio alert. Robertson's audio track has an echo effect that we couldn't get rid of in post. But Fischer and Rob audio (which handle the majority of the discussion) sounds great.***
What’s Discussed:
How NYC brokers reacted to the premier agent feature on StreetEasy
How StreetEasy GM Susan Daimler justified the change
- Home shoppers deserve the option to connect with agent who represents only them
The explicit language used by the StreetEasy product to suggest a buyer agent
Why NYC should seek the counsel of brokerages around the country who have dealt with syndication
How Manhattan real estate does business differently
- Listing agents are used to owning all buyer leads
REBNY’s request for an investigation into the legality of advertising an exclusive listing
The potential to create an MLS in NYC
- Change in compensation model
- Dominance of top ten listing brokers
- Legal ramifications of only sharing data feed with REBNY
The differences among IDX, VOW and StreetEasy’s premier agent
The danger of dual agency
Fischer’s take on leads generated via third-party websites
- Inquiries rarely lead to sales
The evolution of Zillow’s playbook on generating revenue
Why brokerages need to get savvy on how ad tech works
The value of agents as local experts
Compass CEO Robert Reffkin’s concession to Zillow
Resources:
Greg Fischer’s Premier Agent Blog Post
The Real Deal’s Premier Agent Article
The Real Deal’s Premier Agent Video
Connect with Greg Fischer:
The Firestorm Around the Zillow ‘Instant Offers’ Rollout
Industry Relations
06/06/17 • 51 min
If Zillow thought that the industry would thank them for reworking the Open Door model to involve agents in the process of Instant Offers, they underestimated what Rob likes to call Zillow Fever, the intense dislike so many in real estate have toward the company.
Today Rob and Greg are engaged in a rousing conversation about the rollout of the Instant Offers test program and subsequent uproar. They work through the source of the industry’s angst toward Zillow and whether or not it is warranted in this particular case.
Listen in as Rob and Greg discuss the arguments against Instant Offers, how the feature might lend itself to predatory behavior by investors, and how Zillow might have changed their messaging to avoid the blowback.
What’s Discussed:
The firestorm created by Zillow’s Instant Offers test program
Greg’s take on how a different naming convention would have tempered agent reaction
How the Instant Offers feature works
- Response to consumers looking for easier ways to sell
- Hand-picked 15 private investors
- Seller can accept investor offer and sell directly, accept offer and use agent to complete transaction, or reject offer and move forward with agent to list on MLS
The weaknesses of the argument that Zillow is duping consumers
The hypocrisy/lack of awareness of agents criticizing Instant Offers
How agents can use Instant Offer as a tool to generate seller leads
The importance of establishing a sphere of communication
The vast number of tools available to help agents stay in touch with past clients
Instant Offers as a potential avenue for predatory investor behavior
- Bad actors might target the poor, uneducated
- May require government to step in with regulations
Rob’s problem with the premise that consumers cannot make best decision for themselves based on circumstances
The potential monster success of the Instant Offers feature
The flaws in the argument that Zillow is trying to come between the agent and the homeowner
The way Zillow priorities the consumer over the agent
Whether Zillow has given up on trying to make people happy or if they were caught off guard by the negative reaction to Instant Offers
How other big web operators might respond to this innovation
Resources:
Greg Schwartz ‘We Come in Peace’
Connect with Rob and Greg:
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The Dance in DC on Commissions in Residential Real Estate
Industry Relations
06/13/18 • 46 min
1-2 cha-cha-cha. 3-4 cha-cha-cha. DOJ. NAR. FTC. MLS.
There was a dance of sorts held in DC on Tuesday, June 5, when the Department of Justice and the Federal Trade Commission hosted a ‘workshop’ to discuss competition in residential real estate. But while NAR and industry players prepared for the fox trot, bringing their best arguments for maintaining the status quo around data access, the DOJ put on a little salsa music and shifted the discussion to commission transparency and coupling.
Rob and Greg are reversing roles this week, as Greg spins conspiracy theories regarding the government’s intentions and the potential consequences of its intervention in the real estate industry. They speak to organized real estate’s nothing-to-see-here approach to the discussion and review the range of views shared in the Developments in Real Estate Fee and Service Models panel.
Greg explains why decoupling would effectively end the MLS, and Rob covers the paper prepared by the National Bureau of Economic Research suggesting conflicts of interest due to coupling. They address who would benefit if buy-side commissions went away, how such changes would impact portals like Zillow, and the surprising number of industry players who support decoupling. Listen in to understand why Rob and Greg are calling for NAR or CMLS to move on this and start leading the dance to develop solutions around commission transparency.
What’s Discussed:
Organized real estate’s nothing-to-see-here stance at the DOJ/FTC workshop
The Developments in Real Estate Fee and Service Models panel
- Reps from Realogy, Purplebricks, Glass House & TRELORA
Greg’s take that the industry was caught off guard
- Prepared for data access and transparency
- Discussion of commissions, decoupling
How decoupling cooperation and compensation would end the MLS
The NBER paperon realtor commissions and conflicts of interest
The theory that real estate commissions are high due to coupling
Rob’s concern that the DOJ has already made up its mind
Why the industry needs to move on commission transparency
Why real estate is the only industry in which the seller pays the buyer’s rep
How the potential changes might impact portals like Zillow
Who would benefit if buy-side commissions went away
The leadership opportunity for NAR, CMLS to address DOJ/FTC concerns
The surprising number of people in support of commission decoupling
Public response to the previous NAR budget transparency discussion
Resources:
DOJ Residential Real Estate Workshop
Rob’s Blog on the DOJ/FTC Workshop
Brian Boero’s Buzz Saw Blog Post
‘Conflicts of Interest and the Realtor Commission Puzzle’
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Connect with Rob and Greg:
Email [email protected]
Can NAR’s New CEO Bob Goldberg Elevate the REALTOR Brand?
Industry Relations
07/27/17 • 48 min
We can all agree that raising the level of professionalism in the real estate industry is a good thing – absolutely necessary, even. But how do we get there? And who’s responsible for elevating the REALTOR brand? With Bob Goldberg assuming leadership of NAR on August 1, there is much discussion around what he can do to be an agent of change in the industry.
The gloves come off today as Rob and Greg debate the validity of the NAR CEO selection process and the best way to go about ridding the industry of incompetent, unethical agents. They discuss the strengths Bob brings to the table, how his leadership may facilitate cooperation among key players, and the likelihood of substantial policy change with Bob at the helm.
Listen in as Greg and Rob get fired up arguing who’s responsible for making the REALTOR brand meaningful. It is up to NAR to raise standards and differentiate between REALTORS and licensees? Or do brokers need to be held to a higher ideal when it comes to recruiting, hiring and training agents? Whether you’re Team Rob or Team Greg on this one, Bob has his work cut out for him as he takes over NAR this month.
What’s Discussed:
Greg’s experience working with Bob through eNeighborhoods
NAR’s decision to choose someone from inside the organization
Greg’s sense of Bob as a leader
Rob’s take that hiring Bob may have been a ‘done deal’
Greg’s argument that employing a world-renowned recruiting company is ‘thorough’ as opposed to ‘clueless’
Why Rob contends that NAR should have named Bob as successor two years ago
How the NAR membership might have reacted to naming Bob as successor without selection process
How the interview process affords the opportunity for upfront conversation
Greg’s belief in the validity of the selection process
Why a succession plan is more feasible in the corporate world vs. a member-driven organization
Rob’s frustration with the lack of transparency demonstrated by NAR leadership
Greg’s assessment of how things will change with Bob at the helm of NAR
- Shift in tone
- Capacity to facilitate cooperation
Rob’s assertion that conflict in the industry is about policy rather than tone
Rob’s skepticism re: the probability of change in NAR policy
The relationship between personnel and policy
Greg’s assertion that bureaucracy comes from the association side rather than staff
The challenges Bob faces moving forward
- Elevating REALTOR brand
- Incompetent, unethical agents
Greg’s position that brokers are complicit in hiring unqualified agents
Rob’s counter that agents are not employees
- Only Redfin hires employee agents
- Agent pays broker, not vice versa
- Recruiting agents = sales (not hiring)
Why Rob finds it remarkable that any brokers institute standards
How NAR’s code of ethics runs counter to their acceptance of anyone with a license
Rob’s proposal regarding policy changes that would make the REALTOR brand meaningful
-MLS access no longer tied to membership
-Association staff allowed to take part in ethics hearings
-Remove 1099 exemption for real estate agents
Our Sponsors:
Corelogic Resources:
Rob’s Response to Bill Brown’s Comment
Connect with Rob and Greg:
UpstreamRE’s Relationship Status & a16z’s Scathing Review of Real Estate
Industry Relations
12/22/18 • 51 min
Look into your crystal ball and ask about the future of real estate. A venture capitalist’s vision of the industry eliminates agents entirely in favor of the data a tech company can provide. A number of brokers are hoping to go back to the future and once again serve as the gatekeepers for real estate listings. Meanwhile UpstreamRE can’t seem to get a clear picture of its future at all. Will software ‘eat the real (estate) world’ as the recent a16z video suggests? Will brokerages find a way to regain control of their listings? Will UpstreamRE ever nail down an objective?
Rob and Greg start their review of recent real estate news with a discussion of the humbling Andreessen Horowitz video exposing the obvious flaws in organized real estate. They cover Alex Rampell’s argument against the narrative of agent as ‘trusted advisor’ and his thesis that metrics will eventually replace agents. Rob describes how technology might impact the future number of real estate agents and how much consumers will be willing to pay for guidance from a professional.
Greg shares his frustration with the ‘obvious BS’ surrounding UpstreamRE’s breakup with NAR, offering his take on why the alliance didn’t work and the new narrative around the company’s purpose. Rob and Greg both deliver their predictions regarding who UpstreamRE’s new vendor might be and how MLS providers may view the project’s latest pivot. Listen in for insight into the futility of broker efforts to regain control of listings and learn why UpstreamRE’s new vendor may want to ask for their money up front!
What’s Discussed:
The Andreessen Horowitz video on organized real estate
Alex Rampell’s argument against the ‘trusted advisor’
The prediction that metrics and data will replace agents
Mike Delprete’s insight on loss aversion in transactions
Money and partnerships vs. execution in tech startups
The impact of tech on the number of real estate agents
Why UpstreamRE’s partnership with NAR didn’t work
The new narrative around UpstreamRE’s objectives
Rob & Greg’s predictions re: UpstreamRE’s new vendor
How MLS providers may view UpstreamRE’s latest pivot
The futility of broker efforts to regain control of listings
Resources:
When Software Eats the Real (Estate) World
The Hard Thing About Hard Things: Building a Business When There Are No Easy Answersby Ben Horowitz
Who Is Michael Ovitz?by Michael Ovitz
Mike Delprete on Loss Aversion
New York Times Financial Crisis 2019 Article
The Red Dot
Connect with Rob and Greg:
04/15/20 • 57 min
Imagine a best-case scenario in which the Coronavirus is under control and the country is up and running by May 1. How have our social norms changed? What do these cultural shifts mean for organized real estate? And how is the industry different in a post-COVID-19 world?
On this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg get relentlessly positive, discussing the post-Coronavirus landscape of the real estate industry should the best happen. They weigh in on the cultural shifts that are likely to occur in the aftermath of COVID-19, predicting which rituals will persist once the current restrictions have been lifted.
Greg and Rob go on to debate what open houses will look like in a post-pandemic world, why showings may (or may not) be restricted to serious buyers, and when we might be back to pre-COVID transaction levels. Listen in for our hosts’ best-case expectations regarding buyer demand as well as NAR membership and brokerage numbers come September—pending a V-shaped recovery.
What’s Discussed:
Rob & Greg’s parameters for this potential best-case scenario
- Vaccine or cure for virus (no resurgence)
- All restrictions lifted, back to work on 5/1
How the culture is likely to shift in the aftermath of COVID-19
What open houses will look like in a post-Coronavirus world
Why Rob believes showings will be restricted to serious buyers
When we might be back to pre-pandemic transaction levels
Why Greg expects a best-case scenario uptick in buyer demand
Rob’s prediction of a 20% drop in first-time homebuyers
Why Rob & Greg anticipate a 20% decline in NAR membership
How Rob & Greg differ around which agents will leave
The potential for 25% of small brokerages to join a larger team
Connect with Rob and Greg:
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Industry Relations Episode 61: Diagnosing Zillow Angst – with Errol Samuelson, Chief Industry Development Officer at Zillow Group
Industry Relations
02/25/21 • 51 min
Zillow has been consumer-centric since its inception in 2006. And in the early days, the tech company didn’t pay much attention to agents. Now Zillow realizes that reducing friction for consumers means helping agents respond to online leads and schedule showings, for example. But is it too late to earn the industry’s trust?
Errol Samuelson is the Chief Industry Development Officer at Zillow Group. With 25 years of experience in proptech, he served in leadership roles at Realtor.com, Top Producer Systems and Move, Inc. before joining Zillow in 2014. On this episode of Industry Relations, Errol sits down with Rob and Greg to explain why Zillow is acquiring ShowingTime and explore what’s behind the industry’s volatile reaction to the announcement.
Errol discusses the real estate industry’s distrust of Zillow, acknowledging the frustration the tech company has caused over the years and assuring us that his team will not misuse ShowingTime data. Listen in to understand how Errol thinks about CoStar as a competitor and learn why he believes an industry without cooperation and compensation is not good for agents, brokers or consumers.
What’s Discussed:
Why the real estate industry went apeshit over Zillow’s acquisition of ShowingTime
Zillow’s assurance that ShowingTime will remain an open platform with a strict privacy policy
What problem Zillow is trying to solve by acquiring ShowingTime
Errol’s insight on the rumor that Zillow bought ShowingTime to keep it out of CoStar’s hands
How Errol thinks about the fact that people assume Zillow is lying
Errol’s acknowledgement of the frustrations Zillow has caused agents over the years and how the company’s behavior may have amplified the industry’s distrust
The possibility that social class and age are a factor in the industry’s mistrust of Zillow
The focus of Zillow’s Q4 earnings call (Zillow Offers vs. streamlining the consumer experience overall)
Why innovation in the lending space is limited by federal regulations
The unique opportunity Zillow has to innovate around ownership models
Errol’s thoughts on CoStar as a competitor and why CoStar’s success hinges on the government putting an end to cooperation and compensation
Connect with Errol:
Connect with Rob and Greg:
Resources:
Rob’s Post on Zillow, ShowingTime & Paranoid Realtors
Zillow’s Press Release on Acquiring ShowingTime
Zillow’s Q4 2020 Earnings Call
Gary Keller’s 2021 Family Reunion Vision Speech Recap
Rob’s 2020 List of the Seven Most Interesting People in Real Estate
Federal Regulations on Mortgage Finance
09/30/20 • 56 min
Zillow started out as a listing portal or syndication site. But the company has evolved to become... Well, we’re actually not sure what to call it anymore. Perhaps ‘the Amazon of real estate’ is most appropriate. And on September 23, 2020, the company announced that it’s hiring employee-agents to streamline the iBuyer process. So, if Zillow is a brokerage now, what does that mean for the industry?
On this episode of the podcast, Rob and Greg are discussing Zillow’s decision to take its iBuyer operations in-house and how that move will impact other aspects of organized real estate. Our hosts explore how MLSs might respond to having Zillow as members and describe how access to MLS data could change the consumer experience on the Zillow site.
Rob and Greg go on to consider the impact of Zillow being part of NAR and state and local associations, weighing in on how their participation can be seen as a win for the industry. Listen in for insight on how Zillow’s announcement demonstrates their commitment to becoming an iBuyer-brokerage and learn how Zillow entering the system might lead to an improvement for everyone—or a ‘horror show.’
What’s Discussed:
The evolution of listing portals into brokerage and iBuyer hybrid models
How Rob and Greg define brokerages differently
Zillow’s decision to use employee-agents to bring its iBuyer operations in-house
How MLSs are likely to respond to having Zillow as members
Rob’s theory on how Zillow might reposition its Industry Relations team
The potential impact of Zillow being part of NAR as well as state and local associations
How to access to MLS IDX data and VOW rules could transform the consumer experience on Zillow
The leverage Zillow has in getting information from smaller MLSs
What makes Zillow’s shift a WIN for humans (and organized real estate)
Connect with Rob and Greg:
Resources:
Opendoor vs. Zillow on Industry Relations EP050
CLAW’s Delay to Syndication Feeds
REALTOR Political Action Committee
NAR’s Rules on Virtual Office Website
The 2008 DOJ-NAR Settlement Agreement
‘It’s a Good Life’ Episode of Twilight Zone
‘A Trifecta! NAR Sued Again Over Buyer-Broker Commissions’ in The Real Deal
Thomas Jefferson’s Quote on Change in Laws and Institutions
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Industry Relations: Bold Moves by Bob Goldberg and National Standards in Real Estate Data
Industry Relations
03/09/18 • 28 min
After seven months in office as CEO of the National Association of REALTORS, Bob Goldberg has made some bold moves with regard to AMP and RESO-compliance. He’s also scored big on Capitol Hill, lobbying last-minute changes to the tax reform bill. And he’s cut the NAR budget by 20% and made some significant staffing changes. But should we be celebrating Bob as a change agent just yet?
Rob and Greg come to you live from the 2018 MLS Executive Workshop in Scottsdale to argue both sides. Yes, Bob has done more in seven months that we have seen from NAR leadership in quite some time, but there is a low bar for change in the association world. The scope of Bob’s success depends on your basis for comparison, and as you may have guessed, our hosts have very different takes on the issue.
Rob and Greg take on other hot topics in real estate as well, covering the major challenges in making Upstream work, the upcoming Department of Justice and Federal Trade Commission workshops around real estate data, and how a set of national standards would impact vendors. Listen in for Rob’s take on potential government mandates and Greg’s insight on the ‘holy grail’ of real estate tech—marrying data standards with permission to sell.
What’s Discussed:
Bob Goldberg’s bold moves as NAR CEO
- Decision to scuttle AMP
- Enforce RESO standards
- Staffing changes
The low bar for change in the association world
How NAR dodged a bullet with Trump’s tax reform
How the governance model affects the pace of change
How cutting the NAR budget by 20% may impact jobs
The standardization required for Upstream to work
The challenges around MLS vendors and unfunded mandates
The upcoming DOJ/FTC workshops re: real estate data
Rob’s take on making RESO standards law
Greg’s insight on how national standards would impact vendors
- Easier for new vendors to enter space
Marrying standards in real estate data with permission to sell
Connect with Rob and Greg:
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FAQ
How many episodes does Industry Relations have?
Industry Relations currently has 216 episodes available.
What topics does Industry Relations cover?
The podcast is about Mls, Entrepreneurship, Podcasts, Technology, Realestate and Business.
What is the most popular episode on Industry Relations?
The episode title 'Industry Relations Episode 48: Industry Relations Episode 48: Networking in a Virtual World & the 2020 MLS Proptech Symposium' is the most popular.
What is the average episode length on Industry Relations?
The average episode length on Industry Relations is 50 minutes.
How often are episodes of Industry Relations released?
Episodes of Industry Relations are typically released every 7 days.
When was the first episode of Industry Relations?
The first episode of Industry Relations was released on Feb 9, 2017.
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