
Deep sea rays & skates with Will White
05/03/24 • 67 min
1 Listener
This month we're talking about the flattest of the elasmobranchs: the bottom-dwelling batoids - the deep sea rays and skates!
We’re kicking off our cartilaginous fishes (Chondrichthyes) mini-series with the batoids - the rays and skates! Sharks are often associated with the deep sea, but did you know that batoids have been observed as deep as 3000m?
We speak with Will White who researches elasmobranchs across the world and who has described 50 species! He talks us through the differences between sharks rays and skates, and how these species utilise the deep sea. We hear about their fascinating (and hugely varied) reproductive strategies like those that are viviparous (will keep the eggs in their uterus) and others that are oviparous (will lay the eggs).
It wouldn’t be a Coffee with Andrew segment without a memorable insight into the world of a fish curator - and this month’s segment is no different! This time, Dr Thom asks Andrew about an unexpected factoid in one of Andrew’s publications: ‘Yolk smells and tastes like sweetened condensed milk’. We find out exactly how Andrew knows this.
We’re really trying to make this project self-sustaining so we have started looking for ways to support the podcast. Here’s a link to our page on how to support us, from the free options to becoming a patron of the show. We want to say a huge thank you to those patrons who have already pledged to support us:
Matthew Gerrard | Jeff Day | Colin Platt
Thanks again for tuning in, we’ll deep-see you next time!
Check out our podcast merch here! Which now includes Alan’s beloved apron and a much anticipated new design...
Feel free to get in touch with us with questions or your own tales from the high seas on:
We’d love to actually play your voice so feel free to record a short audio note!
We are also on
Twitter: @DeepSeaPod, @ArmatusO
Facebook: DeepSeaPodcast, ArmatusOceanic
Instagram: @deepsea_podcast, @armatusoceanic
Keep up with the team on social media
Twitter:
Alan - @Hadalbloke (https://twitter.com/Hadalbloke)
Thom - @ThomLinley (https://twitter.com/ThomLinley)
Georgia - @geeinthesea (https://twitter.com/geeinthesea)
Instagram:
Georgia - @geeinthesea (https://www.instagram.com/geeinthesea/)
Read the show notes and find out more about us at:
Links
Moku Art Studio virtual exhibition
Thom appears on Radio New Zealand
Blog-style articles of our interviews
Here's a nice paper with a few observations of elasmobranch food falls
Bioluminescence 300 millions years older than previously thought
More info on Will and his research
Will’s recent article on a new family of deepwater sharks
Great eggcase hunt - Sharks Trust
Andrew’s book mentioned in Coffee with Andrew
Credits
Theme – Hadal Zone Express by Märvel
Logo Image - Matthias Stehmann et al. (2021)
Edited by - Georgia Wells
This month we're talking about the flattest of the elasmobranchs: the bottom-dwelling batoids - the deep sea rays and skates!
We’re kicking off our cartilaginous fishes (Chondrichthyes) mini-series with the batoids - the rays and skates! Sharks are often associated with the deep sea, but did you know that batoids have been observed as deep as 3000m?
We speak with Will White who researches elasmobranchs across the world and who has described 50 species! He talks us through the differences between sharks rays and skates, and how these species utilise the deep sea. We hear about their fascinating (and hugely varied) reproductive strategies like those that are viviparous (will keep the eggs in their uterus) and others that are oviparous (will lay the eggs).
It wouldn’t be a Coffee with Andrew segment without a memorable insight into the world of a fish curator - and this month’s segment is no different! This time, Dr Thom asks Andrew about an unexpected factoid in one of Andrew’s publications: ‘Yolk smells and tastes like sweetened condensed milk’. We find out exactly how Andrew knows this.
We’re really trying to make this project self-sustaining so we have started looking for ways to support the podcast. Here’s a link to our page on how to support us, from the free options to becoming a patron of the show. We want to say a huge thank you to those patrons who have already pledged to support us:
Matthew Gerrard | Jeff Day | Colin Platt
Thanks again for tuning in, we’ll deep-see you next time!
Check out our podcast merch here! Which now includes Alan’s beloved apron and a much anticipated new design...
Feel free to get in touch with us with questions or your own tales from the high seas on:
We’d love to actually play your voice so feel free to record a short audio note!
We are also on
Twitter: @DeepSeaPod, @ArmatusO
Facebook: DeepSeaPodcast, ArmatusOceanic
Instagram: @deepsea_podcast, @armatusoceanic
Keep up with the team on social media
Twitter:
Alan - @Hadalbloke (https://twitter.com/Hadalbloke)
Thom - @ThomLinley (https://twitter.com/ThomLinley)
Georgia - @geeinthesea (https://twitter.com/geeinthesea)
Instagram:
Georgia - @geeinthesea (https://www.instagram.com/geeinthesea/)
Read the show notes and find out more about us at:
Links
Moku Art Studio virtual exhibition
Thom appears on Radio New Zealand
Blog-style articles of our interviews
Here's a nice paper with a few observations of elasmobranch food falls
Bioluminescence 300 millions years older than previously thought
More info on Will and his research
Will’s recent article on a new family of deepwater sharks
Great eggcase hunt - Sharks Trust
Andrew’s book mentioned in Coffee with Andrew
Credits
Theme – Hadal Zone Express by Märvel
Logo Image - Matthias Stehmann et al. (2021)
Edited by - Georgia Wells
Previous Episode

PRESSURISED: 021 - Deep sea images and AI with Kakani Katija
Our short and to the point PRESSURISED version of episode 21. If you don't have time for the full episode and want to get right to the science without any of our waffle, this is the place to be!
Read the show notes and find the full episode here:
https://www.armatusoceanic.com/podcast/021-ai
We have often talked about how difficult it is the get data from the deep sea... but would you believe that the bottleneck to our understanding of the deep ocean, at least as far as visual data, is processing those images? Turning a picture of the deep sea into a list of species, habitat type, sediment type etc. is a time-consuming process that requires a wide range of skilled people.
Due to time/funding constrains a lot of valuable information is lost. A team looking at a specific question will have lots of information in their data that other teams could use.
A picture is worth a thousand data points.
We chat with Dr Kakani Katija, the co-founder of FathomNet, an open-source repository for labelled deep-sea imaging data. The platform is still in beta but it is hoped that it will allow scientists to easily and usefully share their amassed data in a single and easily searchable place.
But what about that processing bottleneck? The tech-savvy listener may have noticed that a massive collection of labelled image data is exactly the sort of thing you need to train a Machine Learning or Deep Learning algorithm. Can we automate a lot of the time-consuming image processing and let the experts focus on the new and unusual stuff? It’s at this cutting edge that things get exciting and we may be at the cusp of a marine science renaissance.
We also launch our podcast merch! Please do send in any pics of you wearing the merch. We find the idea of real people in the actual world wearing this so surreal!
Feel free to get in touch with us with questions or you own tales from the high seas on:
We are also on
Twitter: @ArmatusO
Facebook: ArmatusOceanic
Instagram: @armatusoceanic
Read the show notes and find out more about us at:
GlossaryArtificial Intelligence (AI) – A science dedicated to making machines think in an intelligent way, mirroring a biological brain.
Data pipeline – A path that raw data follows to become useful information.
Deep Learning – a more complex subset of ML that mirrors the way a brain works
Machine Learning (ML) – computers learning to perform a task without being explicitly programmed to do so
ML/AI model or algorithm – A model that has been trained on real data and can now process new data itself.
Online Repository – A database stored online so that people can access it from anywhere
Open Source – A publicly accessible design that people can freely repurpose and adapt.
Visual data – photos or video as a form of scientific data
LinksKakani’s Twitter
FathomNet goodiesThe FathomNet website – have an explore of the labelled deep-sea critter data
FathomNet GitHub – take a peek under the hood or even get involved
FathomNet articles with tutorials/explanations
NOAA Science Seminar, 8 March 2022 1200-1300 PST (UTC-8)
FathomNet Workshop, 31 March & 1 April 2022 0800-1100 PST (UTC-8)
Internet of Elephants (gamifying processing camera-trap data)
Beyond Blue (game)
CreditsTheme – Hadal Zone Express by Märvel
Logo image - PRESSURISED logo
Next Episode

PRESSURISED: 046 - Deep sea rays & skates with Will White
Our short and to the point PRESSURISED version of episode 46. If you don't have time for the full episode and want to get right to the science without any of our waffle, this is the place to be!
Read the show notes and find the full episode here:
https://www.armatusoceanic.com/podcast/046-rays
This month we're talking about the flattest of the elasmobranchs: the bottom-dwelling batoids - the deep sea rays and skates!
We’re kicking off our cartilaginous fishes (Chondrichthyes) mini-series with the batoids - the rays and skates! Sharks are often associated with the deep sea, but did you know that batoids have been observed as deep as 3000m?
We speak with Will White who researches elasmobranchs across the world and who has described 50 species! He talks us through the differences between sharks rays and skates, and how these species utilise the deep sea. We hear about their fascinating (and hugely varied) reproductive strategies like those that are viviparous (will keep the eggs in their uterus) and others that are oviparous (will lay the eggs).
We’re really trying to make this project self-sustaining so we have started looking for ways to support the podcast. Here’s a link to our page on how to support us, from the free options to becoming a patron of the show.
Thanks again for tuning in, we’ll deep-see you next time!
Check out our podcast merch here! Which now includes Alan’s beloved apron and a much anticipated new design...
Feel free to get in touch with us with questions or your own tales from the high seas on:
We’d love to actually play your voice so feel free to record a short audio note!
We are also on
Twitter: @DeepSeaPod, @ArmatusO
Facebook: DeepSeaPodcast, ArmatusOceanic
Instagram: @deepsea_podcast, @armatusoceanic
Keep up with the team on social media
Twitter:
Alan - @Hadalbloke (https://twitter.com/Hadalbloke)
Thom - @ThomLinley (https://twitter.com/ThomLinley)
Georgia - @geeinthesea (https://twitter.com/geeinthesea)
Instagram:
Georgia - @geeinthesea (https://www.instagram.com/geeinthesea/)
Read the show notes and find out more about us at:
Links
More info on Will and his research
Will’s recent article on a new family of deepwater sharks
Great eggcase hunt - Sharks Trust
Credits
Theme – Hadal Zone Express by Märvel
Logo Image - The Deep-Sea Podcast PRESSURISED Logo
Edited by - Georgia Wells
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