Can PPPs incorporate collaborative contracting? | With Riccardo Cosentino and Jim Bernard | S1 EP 10
09/11/23 • 38 min
In this week’s episode, Riccardo switches chairs and guest host, Jim Barnard, asks all the questions. Riccardo shares insights from his Oxford Saïd Business School dissertation on the use of collaborative contracting into major programmes, specifically PPP structures. Riccardo and Jim delve into the complications and complexities of risk management, adversarial situations, stakeholders and shareholders and private financing.
“When you have collaborative contracting, you almost waive your legal rights or your rights to pursue legal remedies. And so, all of the parties are around the table. There are many advantages of collaborative contracting, but the simplest one is, instead of hiring lawyers to sort out disputes, you’re redeploying those resources to actually solving project problems.”
Key Takeaways:
- The price of winning contracts in the PPP market and how the public sector entity comes into play
- Why collaborative contracting provides better odds for finishing on time and on budget, but equity has to take more risk
- PPP and politics, how do we navigate it?
The conversation doesn’t stop here—connect and converse with our community:
- Riccardo Cosentino on LinkedIn
- Jim Bernard on LinkedIn
Transcript:
Riccardo Cosentino 00:05
You're listening to navigate the major problems, the podcast that aims to elevate the conversations
happening in the infrastructure industry and inspire you to have a more efficient approach within it. I'm
your host, Riccardo Cosentino brings over 20 years of major product management experience. Most
recently, I graduated from Oxford University Said business school, which shook my belief when it
comes to navigating major problems. Now, it's time to shake yours. Join me in each episode, as I press
the industry experts about the complexity of major program management, emerging digital trends and
the critical leadership required to approach these multibillion-dollar projects. Let's see what the
conversation takes us. Hello, and welcome to a new episode of navigating major programs. Today
we're going to be doing things a little bit differently. My friend, and one point guest of the show as
agreed kindly to be hosting this podcast. And we'll do a role reversal where I'm going to be doing the
presenting and Jim Barnard is going to co-host the show. And today we're going to talk about a topic
that is very close to my heart, which is the use of collaborative contracting into major programs,
especially into PPP structures. I've done a full dissertation at Oxford as part of my master, major
program management, and I decided that it'd be good to walk you through my findings and my
conclusion. Anyway, let me introduce the host for today. Jim Bernard. How you doing? Jim?
Jim 02:00
I'm great. Riccardo, thanks for having me. Big fan of the podcast, obviously had the chance to be on a
previously so very much appreciate the opportunity to be host this time.
Riccardo Cosentino 02:11
So today, as I said, I'll be a be doing the talking. And you'll be doing the asking. Maybe I can start? I'll
jump right into it unless you have a specific question for me. And maybe I can give a bit of a bit of an
overview of my research thesis and some of my findings and some of my conclusions.
Jim 02:34
2
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
Yes, summary will be great, a perfect place to start. But some of our folks listening may not be
completely familiar with even the concept of collaboration. And I know having read your dissertation
that you get into some fairly technical and detailed topics relative to finance and how structures are set
up and that type of thing. So for those of us either less familiar or kind of new to the topic, if you don't
mind, let's start as basic as possible.
Riccardo Cosentino 03:03
Okay, well, let's start with, let's start with what prompted me to research this specific topic, the probably
a good place to start here. I you know, I'm a professional the work in public private partnership over the
last 20 years. So again, a lot of knowledge about the topic, I have structured and finance many
transactions that use non recourse financing. And a couple of years ago, my company decided to exit
the what we call the lump sum turn...
In this week’s episode, Riccardo switches chairs and guest host, Jim Barnard, asks all the questions. Riccardo shares insights from his Oxford Saïd Business School dissertation on the use of collaborative contracting into major programmes, specifically PPP structures. Riccardo and Jim delve into the complications and complexities of risk management, adversarial situations, stakeholders and shareholders and private financing.
“When you have collaborative contracting, you almost waive your legal rights or your rights to pursue legal remedies. And so, all of the parties are around the table. There are many advantages of collaborative contracting, but the simplest one is, instead of hiring lawyers to sort out disputes, you’re redeploying those resources to actually solving project problems.”
Key Takeaways:
- The price of winning contracts in the PPP market and how the public sector entity comes into play
- Why collaborative contracting provides better odds for finishing on time and on budget, but equity has to take more risk
- PPP and politics, how do we navigate it?
The conversation doesn’t stop here—connect and converse with our community:
- Riccardo Cosentino on LinkedIn
- Jim Bernard on LinkedIn
Transcript:
Riccardo Cosentino 00:05
You're listening to navigate the major problems, the podcast that aims to elevate the conversations
happening in the infrastructure industry and inspire you to have a more efficient approach within it. I'm
your host, Riccardo Cosentino brings over 20 years of major product management experience. Most
recently, I graduated from Oxford University Said business school, which shook my belief when it
comes to navigating major problems. Now, it's time to shake yours. Join me in each episode, as I press
the industry experts about the complexity of major program management, emerging digital trends and
the critical leadership required to approach these multibillion-dollar projects. Let's see what the
conversation takes us. Hello, and welcome to a new episode of navigating major programs. Today
we're going to be doing things a little bit differently. My friend, and one point guest of the show as
agreed kindly to be hosting this podcast. And we'll do a role reversal where I'm going to be doing the
presenting and Jim Barnard is going to co-host the show. And today we're going to talk about a topic
that is very close to my heart, which is the use of collaborative contracting into major programs,
especially into PPP structures. I've done a full dissertation at Oxford as part of my master, major
program management, and I decided that it'd be good to walk you through my findings and my
conclusion. Anyway, let me introduce the host for today. Jim Bernard. How you doing? Jim?
Jim 02:00
I'm great. Riccardo, thanks for having me. Big fan of the podcast, obviously had the chance to be on a
previously so very much appreciate the opportunity to be host this time.
Riccardo Cosentino 02:11
So today, as I said, I'll be a be doing the talking. And you'll be doing the asking. Maybe I can start? I'll
jump right into it unless you have a specific question for me. And maybe I can give a bit of a bit of an
overview of my research thesis and some of my findings and some of my conclusions.
Jim 02:34
2
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
Yes, summary will be great, a perfect place to start. But some of our folks listening may not be
completely familiar with even the concept of collaboration. And I know having read your dissertation
that you get into some fairly technical and detailed topics relative to finance and how structures are set
up and that type of thing. So for those of us either less familiar or kind of new to the topic, if you don't
mind, let's start as basic as possible.
Riccardo Cosentino 03:03
Okay, well, let's start with, let's start with what prompted me to research this specific topic, the probably
a good place to start here. I you know, I'm a professional the work in public private partnership over the
last 20 years. So again, a lot of knowledge about the topic, I have structured and finance many
transactions that use non recourse financing. And a couple of years ago, my company decided to exit
the what we call the lump sum turn...
Previous Episode
Do Women Need to Play Golf in Order to Lead Major Programmes? With Corail Bourrelier Fabiani | Saïd Business School, University of Oxford | S1 EP 9
Do women still need to get on the course to progress their careers in major programmes? Does The Boys Club still exist in 2023? Inclusivity and ambition—how are they connected? Navigating Major Programmes podcast co-host, Corail Bourrelier Fabiani, shares her Oxford Saïd Business School dissertation’s insightful findings in this week’s episode. Riccardo and Corail take a deep dive into equality, diversity and inclusion in the infrastructure industry uncovering the taboo topics that have been avoided for decades.
“In the research, you can see that women's interests are not really accommodated in major urban transport infrastructure programs,” says Corail. “And there is a big gender data gap, which is kind of reinforcing inequalities in this space. In my opinion, all this is reinforced by the fact that we don't have enough women at the top. So I thought, how are we changing this?”
Corail, the accomplished programme manager behind projects such as the Paddington Square Public Art Programme and the Shard Quarter Public Art Programme in London, concludes the discussion with four steps to solve this complex, systemic issue.
Key Takeaways:
- The seven gender-related challenges in major programmes and how to solve them.
- How language labels leaders as men and how applications can encourage the women talent pool to apply.
- How to alter networking and affinity bias in order to better support women in infrastructure and why women-designed networks with male allies are so vital.
- The scarcity mindset and what happens to women at the top.
The conversation doesn’t stop here—connect and converse with our community:
Transcript:
Riccardo Cosentino 00:05
You're listening to Navigating Major Programmes, the podcast that aims to elevate the conversations happening in the infrastructure industry and inspire you to have a more efficient approach within it. I'm your host, Riccardo Cosentino brings over 20 years of major product management experience. Most recently, I graduated from Oxford University's day business school, which shook my belief when it comes to navigating major problems. Now it's time to shake yours. Join me in each episode, as I press the industry experts about the complexity of major program management, emerging digital trends and the critical leadership required to approach these multibillion dollar projects. Let's see where the conversation takes us. Hi, welcome back to another episode of navigating major programs. Today I'm here with a recurring guest and co-host of this podcast.
Corail 01:03
I am with Corail
Riccardo Cosentino 01:04
l, how're you doing?
Corail 01:06
I am doing great. Thank you, Riccardo,
Riccardo Cosentino 01:08
Thank you for joining us again. Really glad that you're here today. Today, we're gonna talk about your dissertation from your master's degree at Oxford. If I remember correctly, you did a dissertation titled, "do women need to play golf in order to lead measure programs?" really catchy title? But maybe you can tell us a bit more why you picked that dissertation? And what dissertation was all about?
Corail 01:39
Yeah, sure. Yeah. So yeah, this title was kind of a humorous reference to an HBR article, which said that basically, many women in male dominated industries feel compelled to play golf to access to the top leadership network. And my research was about women's network, and how can those women network help change the culture of major program, which are notoriously male dominated environments? And I thought it was funny that some women would think like, Okay, I'm gonna play golf, so make the most important contact, and I was like, okay, is this still happening? Do we still need to go on, on the course to get this important contact. So I did this research as part of our MSc in major program management at the Said business school. And it was really like, out of had the like, how out of an impulse after an event that happened during a master's degree. And I don't know if you remember that. But basically, each year, the program gets the opportunity to do a debate at the famous Oxford Union. And during our cohort, we have Ella a brilliant change manager, men's leader, who proposed the motion for that debate, which was around the importance of gender diversity in major p...
Next Episode
Implementing IPD in Nuclear Mega Projects with Carol Tansley | Saïd Business School, University of Oxford | S1 EP 11
In this week’s episode, Riccardo and guest co-host, Corail, sit down with fellow alumna, Carol Tansley to discuss her Oxford Saïd Business School dissertation on the institutional barriers to adopting integrated project delivery (IPD) on a nuclear mega project. Carol's impressive career, spanning two decades, is rooted in executing major programs for the UK Government Department for Work, HMRC, and DTI. As a recognized authority in large-scale IT and business transformations, her expertise took her to the Middle East, notably participating in the groundbreaking nuclear project in Abu Dhabi, marking the inauguration of the first nuclear power plant in the Arab world. Ninety-seven percent of nuclear major programmes go over time and over budget, so how did Carol (with no nuclear background) participate in delivering one two days early? This is a conversation you won’t want to miss.
“IPD may represent a methodology that would work has been proven to work in first of a kind environments. And while we have the field conditions now to embrace that, we need people that are willing to go out and embrace these new ways of working and seek to implement them.”
Key Takeaways:
- The role Eternal Beginner Syndrome plays in complex nuclear programmes.
- The perceived barriers against adopting new models and how cultural and cognitive biases can masquerade as genuine obstacles.
- Carol’s experience at Nuclear Week in the UK parliament and the future trends of the nuclear industry—energy security goals, securing affordable supplies and tackling climate change.
- Attracting the younger generation to the nuclear sector to support climate solutions and the expected 40 percent growth rate.
The conversation doesn’t stop here—connect and converse with our community:
- Carol Tansley on LinkedIn
- Corail Bourrelier Fabiani on LinkedIn
- Riccardo Cosentino on LinkedIn
Transcript:
Riccardo Cosentino 00:05
You're listening to navigate the major programes, the podcast that aims to elevate the conversations happening in the infrastructure industry and inspire you to have a more efficient approach within it. I'm your host, Riccardo Cosentino brings over 20 years of major product management experience. Most recently, I graduated from Oxford University’s Day business school, which shook my belief when it comes to navigating major problems. Now it's time to shake yours. Join me in each episode, as I press the industry experts about the complexity of major program management, emerging digital trends and the critical leadership required to approach these multibillion-dollar projects. Let's see where the conversation takes us. Carol Tansley was appointed Vice President X energy UK new build projects in September 2022. In this role, she oversees all x-energy's activities towards establishing the XE 100 as the prominent I temperature gas reactor technology in the United Kingdom. Prior to joining IX energy, Carol served as the operational readiness Control Center Director for the early successful Emirates nuclear energy cooperation startup of the Barakah nuclear plant in the UAE. She was also the new Newa energy company director of strategic programs. Prior to this, she served as a senior director for PwC in the UK and UAE, as well as working at Accenture delivering some of the UK is largest public sector change programs. She recently graduated with distinction from the University of Oxford, with an MSc in major program management. Carol's research focuses on causes of poor performance on nuclear mega project, and potential benefits of adopting relational contracting models.
Corail 02:05
Hello, Carol Heller, Ricardo, I'm super happy to talk to you today. And thank you so much for the opportunity to interview Carol on your podcast, Ricardo, I think we all met in Oxford during the MMPMcourse. And it was wonderful to learn about Carol's experience about the nuclear industry, which is one of the most complex industries, you can find say, I think the listener will be so happy to hear about Carol's story and what you have to say are all about the future of this industry. First of all, I was wondering if you could tell us a little bit more about your background and how you fell into the nuclear sector. I know that there is a little value at the start of th...
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