
Libraries Lead!
Beth Patin, Dave Lankes, & Mike Eisenberg
Libraries Lead! is a provocative podcast about all things information & library hosted by Beth Patin (Assistant Professor, School of Information Studies, Syracuse U), Dave Lankes (Professor, iSchool, U of Texas), and Mike Eisenberg (Dean/Professor Emeritus, iSchool, U of Washington). Information age opportunities and challenges affect every aspect of human existence. We wrestle with such topics as social justice, political unrest, mis- and dis-information, kids, family and adult living; education and learning; work, employment, training and jobs; recreation, entertainment, and play; disasters & emergency preparedness with a focus on libraries & information science, services, and systems. 4 segments in approx. 1 hour: WAZZUP, AI WATCH, MAIN TOPIC, and AWESOME LIBRARY THINGY. For Resources & References for All Episodes please go to: https://tinyurl.com/libleadresources
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Top 10 Libraries Lead! Episodes
Goodpods has curated a list of the 10 best Libraries Lead! episodes, ranked by the number of listens and likes each episode have garnered from our listeners. If you are listening to Libraries Lead! for the first time, there's no better place to start than with one of these standout episodes. If you are a fan of the show, vote for your favorite Libraries Lead! episode by adding your comments to the episode page.

Episode 38 (Feb 2025): Stop Calling Them Customers!!
Libraries Lead!
02/02/25 • 63 min
Library & information science for decades has focused on the “user” perspective in systems and services. This includes HCI (human-computer interaction), interfaces, features in search and catalog systems, and ways of improving services (e.g., online/chat reference, maker spaces, events). We provide systems, resources, and services and users use them. Furthermore, "users (or customers) know best," so we should develop and improve systems primarily through user feedback.
But maybe it’s time to move on from piecemeal innovations or improvements for customers, and consider people as whole persons and their places in "community." A customer orientation implies short-term interactions while people in communities are there for the long haul. In this episode, the Libraries Lead team considers this alternative approach and discusses what this might look like for all types of libraries as well as the major information and social media systems used extensively today.

Episode 37 (Jan 2024): Show Me the $$
Libraries Lead!
01/01/25 • 60 min
In the beginning ... of our dot com digital age (roughly from the late 1970s) ... there was a expectation that information and computer technology (ICT) would be a boon to society. Technology could be liberating rather than oppressing. The hope was that new products and services (e.g., personal computers, the Internet, the WWW, search engines, smart phones, social media) would lead to a more equitable, open, and free society. Sadly, that didn’t happen. Instead, the pervasive goal in ICT became monetization—to make a buck and to maximize profits as much and as quickly as possible.
In this episode we’re not going to argue whether this is good or bad thing. We accept that the dominant characteristic in ICT was and still is the drive for commercial triumph. And with an information economy estimated to be around $5.5 trillion today (and growing), there is success beyond anyone’s wildest dreams.
Instead, we want to examine the implications of all this profit-seeking in the information sector. We’ve become aware of a disturbing trend: the decline of the quality in online products and services over time. This phenomenon is described in a Wikipedia entry as “Enshittification” where vendors and entrepreneurs initially “create high-quality offerings to attract users, then they degrade those offerings to better serve business customers, and finally degrade their services to users and business customers to maximize profits for shareholders.”
How big of a concern is enshittification in relation to the nature and quality of information resources and services in the commercial and public sectors? And of course, do we see this trend in the library world as well?

Episode 8: Help, I Need Somebody!
Libraries Lead!
08/10/21 • 45 min
May 26, 2021
Dave Lankes & Mike Eisenberg
In the last episode, Mike ranted about his frustrations and hours spent in trying to reach a human being for assistance with airline reservations, prescriptions, and insurance. In this episode, we dive deeper into the topic of help and information services of all kinds– human, mediated (telephone, digital), online. What’s going on with consumer help and what’s the status of Q&A, Ask a Librarian, and reference services in library land?
In Wazzup, Dave describes the master class in the new librarianship he’s part of with the National Library School of France, and Mike shares concerns stemming from a disturbing text from a friend related to vaccines loaded with mis- and dis-information that raised all kinds of issues about the credibility of information and the undermining of quality of information. Dave’s Awesome Library Thingy spotlights the Toronto Public Library and Pam Ryan, Director, Service Development & Innovation, and their cutting-edge information literacy classes in machine learning, algorithms, public data, AI, and more.
References & Resources
École Nationale Supérieure des Sciences de l’Information et des Bibliothèques: the national library school of France., https://www.enssib.fr/
Angela Craig interview (May 12, 2021), Libraries Lead in the New Normal, Podcast Episode 7. https://www.acechicagoevents.com/libraries-lead-episode-7
Ewen, Lara (May 3, 2021). “Healthy Distance, Telemedicine brings house calls to local libraries,” American Libraries. p. 14. online: https://americanlibrariesmagazine.org/2021/05/03/healthy-distance-libraries-telemedicine/
Radford, M., Costello, L., & Montague, K. (2021). Surging virtual reference services: COVID-19 a game-changer. College & Research Libraries News, 82(3), 106. doi: https://doi.org/10.5860/crln.82.3.106
Toronto Public Library https://www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/
Digital Innovation Series, Toronto Public Library https://www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/search.jsp?N=37867+4288098632
Credits
Audio, Production, and Streaming Services:
Yoni Yemini, ACE Chicago Events

Episode 2: Shots & Systems
Libraries Lead!
04/26/21 • 57 min
February 3, 2021
57 minutes
Dave Lankes & Mike Eisenberg
In this second episode (and our last simultaneous broadcast as part of the Publishers Weekly Skillset Podcast), Mike is all upset about how difficult it was to get an appointment for a Covid vaccine. “This should be a very manageable information problem! Why can’t we set up an easy system for everyone and anyone – using people, databases, systems, and the telephone?” Dave agrees and explains how libraries can support the rollout along with more long-term emergency support services and resources. And, as in every episode, they share “wazzup” and interesting bits from recent library news.
58 minutes
References & Resources
Kerlinger, F. (1986). Foundations of behavioral research (3rd ed.). New York: Holt, Rinehart and Winston.
Institute for Museum and Library Services, US Federal Government. https://www.imls.gov/
Slijkerman, D., & Vlimmeren, T. . (2021). Living libraries: The house of the community around the world.
[A collection of essays on the changing role of public libraries in society.] available free online: https://www.bibliotheekutrecht.nl/living-libraries.html
DeForge, Jeanette (Updated Jan 29, 2021; Posted Jan 28, 2021) "Springfield librarians, elder affairs workers will help residents register online for COVID vaccines." Mass Live. https://www.masslive.com/news/2021/01/springfield-librarians-elder-affairs-workers-will-assist-residents-in-registering-online-for-covid-vaccines.html
Staeger, Steve (February 1, 2021). "The ‘vaccine whisperer’ helps find appointments for seniors." 9 News, Colorado. https://www.9news.com/article/news/local/next/vaccine-whisperer-covid-coronavirus-appointments/73-807a2efd-f20c-4a86-a826-48dd176cf593
Credits
Yoni Yemini from ACE Chicago Events

Episode 1: Libraries Lead! Our very first episode!
Libraries Lead!
04/26/21 • 69 min
January 20, 2021
109 minutes
Dave Lankes & Mike Eisenberg
This is the first episode of our new podcast - Libraries Lead in the New Normal. We aim for a wild conversation between two close friends who share a passion for all things library & information but frequently disagree on specifics.
This episode which was recorded in January 2021 and simultaneously broadcast at that time as part of the Publishers Weekly Skillset Podcast. We originally intended to talk about the pandemic and the emerging new normal. But, the January 6 insurrection and the Biden inauguration took precedent. Dave was particularly moved and wrote a passionate essay that appeared in Publishers Weekly on how libraries and librarians must do more than be repositories of knowledge or passive providers of information services. We must be players in securing a more perfect union through active engagement in civic and educational discourse and building and providing equitable and accessible information systems and institutions.
This episode also includes 2 special segments: “Wazzup” lately and “Awesome Library Thingy” to highlight some amazing libraries and librarians. These segments will be regular features of all episodes.
References & Resources
Lankes, R. D (Jan 22, 2011). “How Libraries Can Help Us Make a More Perfect Union,” Publishers Weekly Online. https://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/by-topic/columns-and-blogs/soapbox/article/85366-can-libraries-make-for-a-more-perfect-union.html
Bowles, Nellie (Jan. 14, 2021, Updated Jan. 17, 2021). “They Can’t Leave the Bay Area Fast Enough,” New York Times. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/14/technology/san-francisco-covid-work-moving.html
Credits
Yoni Yemini from ACE Chicago Events

Episode 32 (April 2024): Optimistically Realistic (or Realistically Optimistic) About AI?
Libraries Lead!
05/03/24 • 57 min
In this episode, we return to one of our favorite topics– the new AI. But rather than focus on the latest “gee whiz” or OMG capabilities, we turn to the societal implications and impact side of the topic. Dave raised this topic wondering if it’s another case of, “this is why we can't have nice things anymore.” Why is it that for world-changing technologies over the past half-century that held great promise for the betterment of humanity (e.g., personal computers, the Internet, the World Wide Web, search, mobile devices, social media) instead wound up adding stress to personal and professional lives, widening economic and social inequality, and became new tools for scams and crime. Is Dave right or is it possible that we can be realistic but optimistic about AI, that is, to be good information people with a necessary critical view - not a tech bro nor a Luddite.
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For References & Resources for this episode visit us at
https://1n2.b2c.myftpupload.com/episode-32-april-2024-optimistically-realistic-or-realistically-optimistic-about-ai For References & Resources of All Episodes Visit us at
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10/01/24 • 71 min
Corrosive AI: Effects On and Expanded Roles Of Libraries and the Information Field
Sigh. It’s not enough that our instantly and continually connected information environment has eroded trust everywhere—including in our public institutions. The Internet, World Wide Web, and social media have been super-spreaders for misinformation (unintended misleading or false information) and dis-information (purposeful spreading of lies or deceptive information). But now, there is an even more powerful force at everyone’s fingertips-Artificial Intelligence. AI now offers a set of multimedia tools and techniques to turbo-charge the creation and communication of false or misleading information. Referred to as “corrosive AI” by our colleague Riley Lankes, AI provides a new level of capability to undermine trust, particularly in government and public institutions, and unfortunately yes, even in libraries.
In this first podcast of our 5th season, and our first season in partnership with Library Journal, we try out some of these new AI tools, focus on the corrosive effects, and conclude with ways that libraries and librarians can help to repair or even avoid the damage.
Also - check out our BONUS VIDEO INTERVIEW - Rebekah Cummings is interviewed by Dave Lankes. Rebekah was chosen to run with Gubernatorial candidate, Brian King. He described Rebekah as: “A mom. A public servant. A librarian. A defender against book banning and censorship. Utahns will be well served by Rebekah’s leadership through her advocacy for intellectual freedom and commitment to empowering families.” Rebekah is the Director of Digital Matters and Associate Librarian at the University of Utah Marriott Library. In 2018 – 2019, Rebekah served as the Utah Library Association President, and she currently serves as the Utah State Library Board Chair.
NOTE: THIS INTERVIEW IS AVAILABLE AS A VIDEO ON THE LIBRARY JOURNAL YouTube Channel at https://youtu.be/kHrNVvyQD_g
For References & Resources for this episode visit us at
https://librarieslead.libraryjournal.com/2024/10/01/episode-34-october-2024-corrosion-and-repair-of-trust-in-public-institutions/
For References & Resources of All Episodes Visit us at
https://librarieslead.libraryjournal.com/

Episode 36 (DEC 2024) – The Days After - What Now?
Libraries Lead!
11/30/24 • 65 min
The election is over, and the reactions are emotional and raw. Some people are cheering; others crying. America is still as divided politically and socially as the day before. Putting those things aside, let’s look ahead from an information & library perspective. What’s in store for us as individuals, families and communities? Are there lessons learned from the campaigns and result from an information perspective? What might the next few years look like for libraries and librarians and those who use and rely on library resources and service? Are there opportunities for libraries to serve and thrive or will it require us to play defense in order to simply survive?

Episode 24 (April 2023): The New AI...It's Complicated
Libraries Lead!
04/24/23 • 66 min
In this podcast episode, Beth, Mike, and Dave dive into the latest advancements in AI, including ChatGPT, Bing, Dall-E, and others. They acknowledge that the new AI technologies are complex and not simply good or bad, black or white. Instead, they explore the nuanced capabilities of these tools and their potential impact on society. The hosts discuss how these AI advancements can be used to improve various industries, such as healthcare and education, while also acknowledging the potential risks and challenges that come with these new technologies.
Note: The above description was written by ChatGPT! Here's the prompt from Mike:
“Write a paragraph description of a podcast episode by Beth, Mike, and Dave about the new AI and capabilities including ChatGPT, Bing, Dall-E, and others. They recognize that the new AI is complicated, not simply good or bad, black or white.”
For References & Resources for this episode visit us at
https://1n2.b2c.myftpupload.com/episode-24-april-2023-the-new-aiits-complicated/
For References & Resources of All Episodes Visit us at
https://1n2.b2c.myftpupload.com/

DeepSeek AI Watch Feb 2025 Episode 38 bonus
Libraries Lead!
02/11/25 • 12 min
From the Libraries Lead Podcast - February 2025, AI Watch Segment.
In this 12 minute video, Dave Lankes explains why DeepSeek is such a big deal. Then, he blows our minds by demonstrating how DeepSeek works and maybe even ... thinks(?) because DeepSeek includes its "chain of thought reasoning and prompting" as it answers questions. Take a look and listen for "under-the-hood" insights into DeepSeek and other AIs.
Audio only is available here.
For the full video of this bonus episode, please go to - https://librarieslead.libraryjournal.com/2025/02/02/ai-watch-feb-2025-deepseek/
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FAQ
How many episodes does Libraries Lead! have?
Libraries Lead! currently has 42 episodes available.
What topics does Libraries Lead! cover?
The podcast is about News, Information Technology, Library, News Commentary, Podcasts, Education and Information.
What is the most popular episode on Libraries Lead!?
The episode title 'Episode 23 (March 2023): March Info Madness – Sports, Information, and Libraries' is the most popular.
What is the average episode length on Libraries Lead!?
The average episode length on Libraries Lead! is 57 minutes.
How often are episodes of Libraries Lead! released?
Episodes of Libraries Lead! are typically released every 27 days, 22 hours.
When was the first episode of Libraries Lead!?
The first episode of Libraries Lead! was released on Apr 26, 2021.
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