My Favorite Apocalypse #4: The Apocalypse Goes Goth

08/02/20 • 46 min

Fantasy+Girls Podcast

FANTASY+GIRLS

My Favorite Apocalypse Ep 4: The Apocalypse Goes Goth
- EJ and Em have been gone...for a while. It is now July—months away from when they began the series in April
- EJ and Em talk about how things have changed since the miniseries began.
- EJ and Em discuss the Black Lives Matter movement, how it is necessary, and how it is changing publishing. The hosts discuss easy ways that you can support Black authors and creators.
- Em and EJ discuss the twitter hashtag #publishingpaidme on twitter and how it revealed the pay gap between white authors and everyone else, especially Black authors in the same genres.
- Em says it is imperative that the SFF genre embrace diversity so that we can experience weird and wonderful stories. EJ explains how this benefits readers and consumers—how everyone benefits when there are more seats at the table filled by diverse authors.
- Em gives credit to the creator of the #publishingpaidme twitter hashtag, author L.L. McKinney. EJ loves all things Alice in Wonderland, and the hosts chat about how good L.L. McKinney’s a new series based on the classic novel, A BLADE SO BLACK, looks.
- EJ asks readers to check out #OwnVoices books and explains exactly what that means and why that is important.
- EJ suggests listeners check out BlackAndBookish.com
- EJ suggests DREAD NATION by author Justina Ireland. The historical fantasy/horror is a fresh take on zombies/zombie hunters. The book manages to be a zombie book that also examines the historic time period and slavery, but is also accessible and modern.
- EJ’s second books suggestion is THE POPPY WAR. The hosts take a tangent down Libby lane. They adore Libby—who wouldn’t? It’s amazing. The Libby app will cause you to read faster because it is a race to read the book before the library takes the book back off of your device. EJ has checked out the POPPY WAR three times because Libby keeps taking it.
- Em says she has been making a cognizant decision to read even more diversely. She is about to give her book picks, but takes a very on-brand detour to say she has been working on a darker work of fiction herself, as well as watching darker shows and even reading darker fiction. EJ jumps on board and says her current show is HANNIBAL..
- Em says that since she has been writing such a dark book, she has been trying to read some fluffy, fun reads to keep her mind right. Em explains she is also currently reading five books at one time (ADHD has perks). Her current read is I WANNA BE WHERE YOU ARE by Kristina Forest.
- EJ just finished THE HAUNTING OF HILL HOUSE. Em suggests taking a Shirley Jackson deep dive.
- Em explains that she knows she is supposed to be talking about the apocalypse, but her current reads have been all over the place. Recently, she has finished CIRCE by Madeline Miller (which is Em’s favorite book of the year so far). Then she read a vampire book. Then a DEXTER book. Then a horror book titled, THE RETURN by Rachel Harrison. Em read MY LOVELY WIFE.
- EJ asks Em if she has heard the buzz about MEXICAN GOTHIC by Silvia Moreno-Garcia. EJ has FOMO. She wants to read it so bad. Em wants all the gothic stories forever and ever.
- Em has a MEXICAN GOTHIC story. Em has been anticipated this book for months and months. She is about to start the audiobook.
- EJ is super excited about the book CATHERINE HOUSE by Elisabeth Thomas.
- Em loves the comps—NEVER LET ME GO is amazing.
- Em is ready to dig into MEM by Bethany C. Morrow.
- WESTWORLD SPOILERS AROUND THE 25 MINUTE MARK.
- Em confesses that she thought she would thrive in the current environment, but now knows she would actually die pretty quickly in a real apocalypse.
- Em’s next book recommendation is FRANKENSTEIN IN BAGHDAD by Ahmed Saadawi.
- EJ says how many people have retreated from the current world into romance novels, however she has fallen into dark, thriller, horror genre novels/shows.
- Em commiserates that she often falls down the dark-fic rabbit hole. Sometimes after a binge, she thinks you need to almost read or watch something light to shake off the morbidity of darker books.
- Full circle to Hannibal. EJ loves it—though it is admittedly gruesome.
- HANNIBAL SPOILERS AROUND THE 28:20 MARK.
- EJ tells a gruesome Hannibal plot point that has Em unable to cope.
- The take another (on-brand) detour to Hannibal.
- Why are our hosts still talking about cannibalism? Who knows?
- Em has watched every WUTHERING HEIGHTS adaptation available to stream. She knows she shouldn’t, but there is something about the toxic/terrible relationship between Heathcliff and Catherine.
- EJ points out that JANE EYRE is in many ways the opposite of Wuthering Heights. Wuthering Heights is no restraint or boundaries—basically two ...

FANTASY+GIRLS

My Favorite Apocalypse Ep 4: The Apocalypse Goes Goth
- EJ and Em have been gone...for a while. It is now July—months away from when they began the series in April
- EJ and Em talk about how things have changed since the miniseries began.
- EJ and Em discuss the Black Lives Matter movement, how it is necessary, and how it is changing publishing. The hosts discuss easy ways that you can support Black authors and creators.
- Em and EJ discuss the twitter hashtag #publishingpaidme on twitter and how it revealed the pay gap between white authors and everyone else, especially Black authors in the same genres.
- Em says it is imperative that the SFF genre embrace diversity so that we can experience weird and wonderful stories. EJ explains how this benefits readers and consumers—how everyone benefits when there are more seats at the table filled by diverse authors.
- Em gives credit to the creator of the #publishingpaidme twitter hashtag, author L.L. McKinney. EJ loves all things Alice in Wonderland, and the hosts chat about how good L.L. McKinney’s a new series based on the classic novel, A BLADE SO BLACK, looks.
- EJ asks readers to check out #OwnVoices books and explains exactly what that means and why that is important.
- EJ suggests listeners check out BlackAndBookish.com
- EJ suggests DREAD NATION by author Justina Ireland. The historical fantasy/horror is a fresh take on zombies/zombie hunters. The book manages to be a zombie book that also examines the historic time period and slavery, but is also accessible and modern.
- EJ’s second books suggestion is THE POPPY WAR. The hosts take a tangent down Libby lane. They adore Libby—who wouldn’t? It’s amazing. The Libby app will cause you to read faster because it is a race to read the book before the library takes the book back off of your device. EJ has checked out the POPPY WAR three times because Libby keeps taking it.
- Em says she has been making a cognizant decision to read even more diversely. She is about to give her book picks, but takes a very on-brand detour to say she has been working on a darker work of fiction herself, as well as watching darker shows and even reading darker fiction. EJ jumps on board and says her current show is HANNIBAL..
- Em says that since she has been writing such a dark book, she has been trying to read some fluffy, fun reads to keep her mind right. Em explains she is also currently reading five books at one time (ADHD has perks). Her current read is I WANNA BE WHERE YOU ARE by Kristina Forest.
- EJ just finished THE HAUNTING OF HILL HOUSE. Em suggests taking a Shirley Jackson deep dive.
- Em explains that she knows she is supposed to be talking about the apocalypse, but her current reads have been all over the place. Recently, she has finished CIRCE by Madeline Miller (which is Em’s favorite book of the year so far). Then she read a vampire book. Then a DEXTER book. Then a horror book titled, THE RETURN by Rachel Harrison. Em read MY LOVELY WIFE.
- EJ asks Em if she has heard the buzz about MEXICAN GOTHIC by Silvia Moreno-Garcia. EJ has FOMO. She wants to read it so bad. Em wants all the gothic stories forever and ever.
- Em has a MEXICAN GOTHIC story. Em has been anticipated this book for months and months. She is about to start the audiobook.
- EJ is super excited about the book CATHERINE HOUSE by Elisabeth Thomas.
- Em loves the comps—NEVER LET ME GO is amazing.
- Em is ready to dig into MEM by Bethany C. Morrow.
- WESTWORLD SPOILERS AROUND THE 25 MINUTE MARK.
- Em confesses that she thought she would thrive in the current environment, but now knows she would actually die pretty quickly in a real apocalypse.
- Em’s next book recommendation is FRANKENSTEIN IN BAGHDAD by Ahmed Saadawi.
- EJ says how many people have retreated from the current world into romance novels, however she has fallen into dark, thriller, horror genre novels/shows.
- Em commiserates that she often falls down the dark-fic rabbit hole. Sometimes after a binge, she thinks you need to almost read or watch something light to shake off the morbidity of darker books.
- Full circle to Hannibal. EJ loves it—though it is admittedly gruesome.
- HANNIBAL SPOILERS AROUND THE 28:20 MARK.
- EJ tells a gruesome Hannibal plot point that has Em unable to cope.
- The take another (on-brand) detour to Hannibal.
- Why are our hosts still talking about cannibalism? Who knows?
- Em has watched every WUTHERING HEIGHTS adaptation available to stream. She knows she shouldn’t, but there is something about the toxic/terrible relationship between Heathcliff and Catherine.
- EJ points out that JANE EYRE is in many ways the opposite of Wuthering Heights. Wuthering Heights is no restraint or boundaries—basically two ...

Previous Episode

My Favorite Apocalpyse #3: And We're All Out of Bubble Gum

FANTASY+GIRLS
My Favorite Apocalypse Ep. 3: And We’re All Out of Bubble Gum

Note: This episode was recorded in April, before the murders of George Floyd and Breonna Taylor at the hands of police, and the subsequent protests. When Em and EJ talk about the current state of the world, they are referring to the very beginning of quarantine. FANTASY+GIRL Podcast stands behind Black Lives Matter. For our full Black Lives Matter statement, commentary on its impact on publishing, and how to support black authors, see the opening of episode 4 in this miniseries.

It is about to get really wacky on here!

Picture this: it’s the ’80s. Perms. Bleached mullets. Bruce Willis still had hair and your favorite hosts were only babies! There’s all kinds of movie goodness that came out during this time. But what she chose is C movie deliciousness that has somehow achieved cult status online. Em discovered this movie during a Halloween parade and has wanted to watch it ever since and she finally had an excuse (as if she needed one!).
Em sets the scene: Imagine your mullet is blowing in the wind. You mosey into town in your acid washed jeans...also you’re a dude. You roll up to a homeless camp that somehow has an outdoor television with cable. But every so often there is static as something breaks illegally into the signal to proclaim, “They are among us and we are only safe because we don’t know about them! Wake up! They live!”
Em is talking about the cult classic THEY LIVE!
The main character of the movie refuses to believe in the scrambled random cable messages until one day when he picks up a random pair of sunglasses and suddenly he can see the truth! They live among us! Aliens disguised as humans! Ah!
With these random tech sunglasses you can read all of the subliminal messages that surround you in daily advertising.
This is the movie that gave us the one liners “You look like last week’s cheese dip!” and “I came here to kick ass and chew bubble gum...and I’m all out of bubble gum!” and “Mama don’t like no tattle tales!” and “Life’s a bitch and she’s in heat.”
There’s no explanation of why the aliens are here, or why we care the aliens are here. The movie definitely isn’t plot heavy and if you love plot holes and senseless action scenes and a definite ’80s aesthetic, this might be for you! Just...don’t overthink it. It’s pretty terrible in a drinking game kind of way.
Em admits that it is more pre-apocalypse than true apocalypse. And it definitely isn’t post-apocalypse.
Em says the movie has quite the online following once she began digging into it.
EJ’s pick is also pre-apocalypse. She asks Em if she is familiar with INVADER ZIM.
EJ was obsessed with Invader Zim in college. It was her first binge watch—before binge watching was a thing. EJ lets Em know she can still find Invader Zim online on youtube.
EJ gives us the premise: there are aliens who are planning to execute Operation Impending Doom 2 (bc Operation Impending Doom 1 failed).
Their entire hierarchy of alien power is based on height. We meet our invader, Zim, who is the reason the first Operation Impending Doom failed.
Invader Zim gets sent to Earth (just so his leaders can get rid of him...although he thinks he is on an important mission.) Every episode is about taking over the world. EJ proclaims that it has one of the best soundtracks of any animated show.
EJ says the show has a very PINKY AND THE BRAIN feel. Em is here for it—she loves Pinky and the Brain.
Em asks EJ if she saw the animated movie Home because the people who wrote it must have been fans of Invader Zim.
Em asks how could they forget HITCHHIKER’S GUIDE TO THE GALAXY by Douglas Adams? EJ says it’s one of the few stories that begins with a true apocalypse—the destruction of the Earth. If Em remembers correctly, the world was destroyed to make room for an interstellar highway and Earth forgot to file paperwork to avoid being destroyed. However, the dolphins knew what was up!
Em talks about how people are still super fans of this series and you can still spot stickers on people’s cars that say, “So long and thanks for all the fish,” and, “Don’t panic!” It makes Em super happy and EJ interjects that it’s always relevant.
Em admits that all of the episodes are running together and she wonders if they were supposed to research sweet apocoli. Who knows?
Em brings up for LOOKING FOR A FRIEND AT THE END OF THE WORLD with Steve Carrell and Kiera Knightly.
EJ brings up the heaviest, artsy, moodiest apocalypse movie: MELANCHOLIA. Melancholia is dark the entire time, however it was visually beautiful.
EJ says that the movie was more about beautiful scenes than plot.
Em still struggles saying Apocalyptic....

Next Episode

Not Your Scream Queen #1: Jennifer's Body

Right from the get-go, Em and EJ agree there’s an important topic that, coming out of the My Favorite Apocalypse series, we have not touched on enough: Cannibalism. It only comes up a few times every episode, we promise to do better.
Which brings us to JENNIFER’S BODY, our first pick for the miniseries.
But put a pin in that, Em has some ideas: Since we’ve decided to focus this new miniseries on women of horror--writers, directors, actors, and more--she suggests calling it Not Your Scream Queen. That or Spooky Girls.
EJ is ready to roll but has no clue what movies these are--because they’re not. They’re title ideas for the series. Hello.
Not Your Scream Queen hits instant icon status.
The full series will feature a close-up assessment of five different horror films. They don’t necessarily have feminist themes, but they’re all told by women to varying degrees. Which is perhaps somewhat feminist in itself?
Horror tropes have become so misogynistic within pop culture (not by genre!) that anything that deviates from that misogyny feels like it is inherently making a statement.
Em notes that growing up, if there was a girl in a horror film, by the end she was sure to be covered in blood and half naked. And those films aren’t always trash, but when that’s all that ever happens, come on.
EJ adds that if you’re not even playing with your tropes, and merely rehashing, where’s even the fun in that?
In this series, Em and EJ are here to examine this issue and have some good spooky fun.
The films chosen for this series are female-written, directed, led, produced, or touch on “female” themes (or at least themes broadly considered female). We aimed for two of three of these for all films included.
And, most of them, we’re going in blind--including our first pick for today’s episode, Jennifer’s Body, starring Megan Fox and Amanda Seyfried.
Em remembers in the early 2000s when Megan Fox spoke out about her mistreatment during filming and auditioning for TRANSFORMERS by Michael Bay, and how she got blown off for it. She had to wash his car in a bikini for the audition. So cringey.
Now with #MeToo and the evolution of the conversation of women’s equal treatment, this would never be acceptable, but then, no one wanted to hear it.
We all owe Megan Fox an apology.
And, we like to believe, we’ve come a long way since this film released in 2007--not so very long ago!
So let’s start with a synopsis: we snagged ours from Wikipedia.
First of all, this film had an incredible cast! Not just Fox and Seyfried, but also with appearances from a pre-fame Chris Pratt, JK Simmons (and out of typecasting to boot), Amy Sedaris, everywhere you turn there was a big name. Even most of the guys who play Jennifer’s victims were very familiar looking.
Not to mention, writers and director Diablo Cody--indie queen of JUNO, YOUNG ADULT, TULLY ... a brilliant lady.
And of course, the film has earned a cult following since its original flop release.
For Em, there were a few reactions, and one was a hard cringe at the accuracy of this film’s reflection of being a teen in the 2000s -- the hair, the styles, the slang.... save us from our former selves.
The other big takeaway: In what universe is Amanda Seyfriend the “plain” best friend?
They at least tried with the classic 90s trick of giving the gorgeous actor glasses to make them a nerd.
Em observes the film starts with Seyfriend’s character, Needy, in jail after the events of the movie--she’s a kicker. Okay. But that line never circled back to any bigger meaning.
Was it because she’d always been the sidekick? She offed the person she was sidekick too?
And let’s not forget The Kiss. A kiss between Jennifer and Needy was prominently featured in the film’s trailers, and it was a clear effort to pander to the teen guy horror cliche crowd.
But in the context of the film, and per Cody’s commentary, Needy was written to be a little in love with Jennifer from the start. Maybe romantically, but also could be taken to be that complicated way teen girls relate to each other--there’s always that one girl everyone seems to adore, or perhaps want to trade places with.
There was an obsession between Needy and Jennifer, and a codependency that was very complicated and twisted.
It says a lot about female friendship, about high school dynamics, about developing our own identities.
Em suggests the film is a portrait of a toxic friendship.
Even though Needy was second fiddle, but still Jennifer won’t do anything without Needy. There clear rules to their dynamic, including what to wear and how to look, to ensure those dynamics stay in place.
EJ calls out that we’ve all been t...