Exponential Leadership

My name's Eksteen De Waal, and today I'm talking to Rieneke Deelstra. One of the things that's always struck me about Rieneke is that she's not somebody that brags, even though she's done some amazing things in life. She's led large-scale transformations within government, she has consulted and coached leaders at the highest level in local government and in the civil service, and at the same time, part-time, she's also qualified as a clinical psychologist. She just gets on with it and gets it done, and it's such a way that everybody just feels comfortable with her. Now, most coaches probably achieve this, but Rieneke is really special in this regard. She's got a way of helping you see a different perspective without it being forced, and I think that's an amazing ability. Now can you imagine how wonderful that is in a time of crisis?

So today we talk about what leadership in a crisis means. What is the impact on top leadership, middle management, and on the employees that work with the clients or the customers?

So we start talking about what does it mean now for hybrid working? What is the scope of what we term as crisis, or in a crisis how do we get our scope as clear as possible? Then we talked about what it is to impress leaders. We then go on to talk about what working with teams means for their improvement during a time of crisis, and how do you interact with your employees in a time of crisis.

How does confidence feature into this and how can reflection with others and bouncing ideas off of others help you? We also talk about how lonely it is at the top, and about the importance of cognitive empathy, and then looking at triggers and previous traumas and how that feeds into a crisis. We then do a quick stop where we talk about coaching versus psychiatry or psychology. And we talk about the attitudes towards. But also attitudes towards security, peace of mind, vulnerability and even mental health in leaders.

I wonder if Rieneke knows how blessed people are to work with her. And I'm not just gushing. Iit's always a genuine pleasure to talk to her and I find her insights very valuable. I think talking about middle-management and the impact of loneliness in senior management has yet again shone light for me on that we tend to forget that leaders are just people.

When we lead organizations, we also need our support. We also need those people that fight for us. They'll tell us we're doing an okay job, as long as they’re not yes-sayers and they’re people that can understand the vulnerabilities, but at the same time, also be honest and straight up with us. I think those kinds of people need to be cultivated, especially ones with high cognitive empathy that can show you things that you may not be able to see.

So what if you worked for an organization that has been 200 years in the making, adheres to no rules of society, abides by no laws, and rules with an iron fist? And that is the numbers gang in South Africa, it rules most of the prisons. And specifically, in this case, I'm talking to Welcome Witbooi, and he led 2,700 people out of the 7,000 inmates at Pollsmoor prison, one of the maximum security prisons in the world, and one of the top 10 most dangerous prisons. So is there leadership in crisis more than a gang leader in a prison? Where you’re constantly under surveillance, constantly being judged and have to perform or your life is at stake.

Well today I’m talking to Welcome Wibooi about that. And we talk about how he got into gangs and what that meant. And then we move on to the hierarchy where we talk about how does the structure of such a gang or such an organization work because it's been around for a while. So, how does it police? How does it govern? How does it operate? What are the operational parameters? What are the sales parameters? What does your supply chain look like? How do you manage all of that? And then how do you discipline? How do you make choices that you know, could cost someone their life? Not just that. How far do you think that through?

We talk about loyalty. We talk about trust and distrust. And who do you trust, but also talk about what can we learn from that and do a comparison between that and modern day corporates? Well, I hope you enjoy this session today because I really enjoy talking to welcome. And he is an interesting character, in that he's reformed and runs his own charity, and at the same time he’s doing his MBA. What a turnaround and what insights. Enjoy this with me.

You know, what I'm taking from the conversation with Welcome today is that he actually thought more about the consequences of applying penalties. Yes. In his case, it would mean someone's life very often. But how often in corporate business do we not make that consideration, not think of the impact, not only on the person, but their coworkers, everybody that they work with, the performance impact on the organization as a whole, or in that department, what mitigating factors we need to put into place.

And it's not just about their skill or their ability, but how could it impact the people around them? Do we think about the emotional impact, the relational impact and the wider impact on that person's family and their friends and associates. He thought about those elements before he made his final decision.

I'm just wondering if we can learn from that in our modern day, corporates. Be a little bit more conscious of what our teams and our organizations really need and be decisive, but considerate.

In today's podcast, I'm talking to Dorine Velhuyzen, who’s had a very interesting career. She started off by travelling around the world and discovering some communities in Africa, specifically that needed help. She created foundations and charities over the years to help those people in need.
And today she's leading the charge for babies and expectant mothers in the Netherlands in healthcare. I think during this some interesting insights around leading. And in this podcast, we first start off with a journey around the world and then looking at what she's doing today and how the connections that she's formed have helped her in leading and leading for definite and lasting change.
I think what I found most interesting in this conversation with Dorine is that there's always a sense of connection. There's always a sense of connectedness, no matter where she is in the world is looking for those connections that will bring together a network or create a new network that supports not only people locally in a community but attaches them to an international community. I also think those connections, those abilities of hers to ask the right questions. I mean, she's challenged me quite a few times, by asking me some amazing questions, I learn from it all the time. And I think that is one of the things that. I've learned here in the Netherlands and to me, is that they're the epitome of” ask the right question”. Keep on asking the questions till you get the answers that you need to find the best solutions. Don’t just take for granted what people give you as information, always dig a little bit deeper, always find out is that the real reason behind things?
And I think as leaders, that's really important thing to learn for ourselves is that people will sometimes give us the answers they think we want, or even the answers they think we need. But very often we don't get the answers that help us make better decisions. So let's ask a few more, what, and a few more hard questions thrown in a few more open-ended ones at people at sea. If we cannot find out what is both the content we're missing and maybe the emotional turmoil that goes beyond that.
https://nl.linkedin.com/in/dorineveldhuyzen/nl
https://www.linkedin.com/company/babyconnect/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/dorineveldhuyzen/
https://www.facebook.com/dorine.veldhuyzen.1 https://twitter.com/TALMOR_Dorine
www.babyconnect.org
www.carecodex.org

A hypothesis is not the same as a theory or hypothesis is something that we can actually say what the statistical validity of it is. So unlike a normal mathematical formula, which tells us every dot to keep in line with hypothesis, we say, what is the statistical chance of something being in a specific spot? I imagine that if you have a mind that is almost predictive in using information to try and figure out what are the chances of something happening or not happening, what would that mind mean for an entrepreneur.
What would that mean for leadership?
And today talking to Anastasia, the question is, what does that mean for a refugee fleeing the war in Ukraine? When you step into your car and you have to drive in a direction, which direction do you choose? What is the statistical probability of arriving safe. And how do you adjust on the road? What does that mean for entrepreneurship?
What does that mean for academia? And what does that mean if you get cancer? Anastasia takes us on her journey from academia to entrepreneuriship to cancer to fleeing the Ukraine and now adjusting to finding a new life, even if it's temporary, but to find a new life in a different country than what she's used to, and yet stay connected and figuring out the probabilities of what wouldn't be successful.
I hope you enjoy today's session with Anastasia because I think it can teach us a lot about having the right mindset to overcome massive adversity .
I think what I learned most today from my interaction with Anastasia is that when the proverbial shit hits the fan and you have to find a way forward looking at the possibilities, the options, looking at ways in which you can find some form of resolution to just put your one foot in front of the other helps you to find the direction that you need in the moment to keep going. I'm not sure if that is part of long-term resiliency, but definitely in the short term, because I think in long-term resiliency, We will also need to deal with those things that have happened to us and all of us deal with things differently.
It doesn't matter how heavy the situation is you come out of, for some people, the threshold is lower for traumatic experience. We see with PTSD, the same thing, I remember, my struggles with PTSD and what that taught me about my own consciousness and my own ability to deal with stresses and all the tools I learned along the way.
I definitely believe that when you ever come adversity, you learn a lot, not just about your reaction to your environment but about what you can and cannot do. And you learn tools to be better off the next time. I don't wish adversity on anyone, but I'm thankful for that which I've had, which has allowed me to become more resilient and stronger and taught me the tools that I can now help other people.
I wish this for Anastasia and for all the Ukrainians that currently fleeing the war and all refugees. Did you find the strength and you find the wisdom to learn the tools that you need for later in life? Because every adverse situation can be an opportunity for growth, no matter how bad.
As long as it doesn't break you, you will learn something.
And if you've gone through something like having nightmares, you're not sleeping, while you break out in cold sweats. You have unexplained reactions and triggers. When somebody say something you overreact, just think about it. You may have had a traumatic experience. You may have such deep seated trauma that you may need to seek help.
And I knew the help that I sought in my life has helped me to learn more about myself and to find new coping methods. So don't be afraid to reach out. There are always people that are willing to help or you need to do is ask.

Our guest today is a neuroscientist, business psychologist and recalibrating your brain expert. She has owned three businesses, she is an international professional speaker (in fact she is the current National President of the Professional Speaking Association UK&I) mentor to senior business people, founder of the Neuroscience Professional Development Programme and the Learning Lab, and is often in international newspapers and magazines and a regular guest on national radio.
I think what really stuck with me today is that for starters, when you start getting to the metaverse, we're not quite sure yet what would form in and outgroups, I personally think it is the way that we can represent ourselves within the metaverse. If we look at gaming, for instance, who has the best gear, who looks the spiciest, who has the most knowledge of the environment, each one of those creates its own little group. You also have things like formalised structures like gills , will those kinds of things happen in the metaverse as well, we have these VR worlds that we've been around for awhile, but the full immersion of it, now looking at at the metaverse, what will that mean for team engagement and for a biological need to be able to see people's facial expressions and how much of that would already happen.
I Mean, one of the things that zoom and other platforms are adding is the ability to change your face into an avatar that picks up on your lip movement and your eyebrows, but not full facial expression yet, but we're getting close. So how long would it be for somebody that is as overweight as me can look slim and svelte and buff on a metaverse and would I want to?
The other thing that I enjoyed today in the session with Linda was about leadership and the impact that leaders can have on returning to the office. We tend to think that things may go back the way it was, but what if it doesn't, what if hybrid is here to stay? When should people be in the office? I think Linda makes a very good point in that we need to find a day where everybody's together. And not cram it just full of meetings and activities for people to do, but get people to bond, find ways in which people can connect. Even if it's during a meeting, make sure that those interpersonal relationships are built , which gives us loyalty, which gives us connection with gives us binding to the company and organizational citizenship behavior. Instead of it just being a bunch of people that get together every so often and do stuff together. Well, I hope you enjoyed learning as much as I did today.
LinkedIn: http://uk.linkedin.com/in/lyndashaw
Website www.drlyndashaw.com