
#32: Scrum in High School Sports with Cort Sharp
01/25/23 • 34 min
Join Cort Sharp and Brian Milner as they discuss experimenting with Scrum in other out-of-the-box environments, including how Cort uses it to train the high school swim team he coaches.
Overview
In this episode of the Agile Mentors podcast, Cort Sharp joins Brian to explore how to use Scrum tools in other environments outside of the software development arena.
Cort shares the lightbulb moment when he realized Scrum might help him become a more effective coach for his high school swim team.
Listen in as he walks us through his real-world experience using Scrum to coach swimmers, including what worked and what didn't and how he redefined things to make using Scrum successful for the team.
Listen now to discover:
[01:27] - Brian introduces Cort Sharp, the Agile Mentors Community Manager and high school swim coach.
[02:49] - Scrum is used chiefly in software, BUT there are other options. Examining out-of-the-box uses from Scrum.
[03:46] - Cort shares the story of how he got started as a high school swim coach.
[06:26] - Cort meets Scrum.
[08:39] - The discovery during Certified Scrum Training that led Cort to believe he could use Scrum to become a more effective swim coach.
[10:20] - Brian shares his own light bulb moment from his first exposure to Scrum.
[11:53] - What’s the product: Cort shares the process of translating Scrum to the swimming world.
[15:57] - How the sprint review brought everything home for Cort.
[17:03] - Evaluating how things were working with the parents of the swimmers (the stakeholders) at the weekly invitational swim meets.
[17:48] - Brian describes how Scrum helps you break things down into smaller, digestible chunks when you want to reach a big goal but don't see progress every day.
[19:02] - Cort shares how they developed the user stories for each swimmer and used feedback to develop the backlog for swim practices.
[19:44] - Cort shares the process of developing the backlog for swim practices.
[21:19] - How Agile principles (i.e., sustainable pace) translate into arenas other than software.
[24:30] - Cort explains how Scrum events like daily stand-ups and sprint reviews helped the team organize practices.
[24:47] - Which Scrum practices were harder to implement for the team? [26:47] - Opening yourself up to experimentation. (And how to reach Cort with your coaching ideas and suggestions).
[27:36] - Cort shares the biggest changes he had to make to make things work for the swim team.
[28:00] - So, who is the Scrum Master for the swim team? Redefining the Scrum roles and responsibilities to make them work in other environments.
[30:04] - Cort shares what he’s learned in the process of using Scrum with the swim team.
[33:29] - Do you have a topic or guest you'd like to see on the Agile Mentors podcast? If so, send us an email. We'd love to hear from you.
References and resources mentioned in the show
- #21: Agile Marketing Teams with Stacey Ackerman
- #23 How Agile Works in Education with John Miller
- The Agile Mentors Community
Want to get involved?
This show is designed for you, and we’d love your input.
- Enjoyed what you heard today? It would be great if you left a rating and a review. It really helps, and we read every single one.
- Got an agile subject you’d like us to discuss or a question that needs an answer? Share your thoughts with us as [email protected]
This episode’s presenters are:
Brian Milner is SVP of coaching and training at Mountain Goat Software. He’s passionate about making a difference in people’s day-to-day work, influenced by his own experience of transitioning to Scrum and seeing improvements in work/life balance, honesty, respect, and the quality of work.
Cort Sharp is the Scrum Master of the producing team and the Agile Mentors Community Manager. In addition to his love for Agile, Cort is also a serious swimmer and has been coaching swimmers for five years.
Join Cort Sharp and Brian Milner as they discuss experimenting with Scrum in other out-of-the-box environments, including how Cort uses it to train the high school swim team he coaches.
Overview
In this episode of the Agile Mentors podcast, Cort Sharp joins Brian to explore how to use Scrum tools in other environments outside of the software development arena.
Cort shares the lightbulb moment when he realized Scrum might help him become a more effective coach for his high school swim team.
Listen in as he walks us through his real-world experience using Scrum to coach swimmers, including what worked and what didn't and how he redefined things to make using Scrum successful for the team.
Listen now to discover:
[01:27] - Brian introduces Cort Sharp, the Agile Mentors Community Manager and high school swim coach.
[02:49] - Scrum is used chiefly in software, BUT there are other options. Examining out-of-the-box uses from Scrum.
[03:46] - Cort shares the story of how he got started as a high school swim coach.
[06:26] - Cort meets Scrum.
[08:39] - The discovery during Certified Scrum Training that led Cort to believe he could use Scrum to become a more effective swim coach.
[10:20] - Brian shares his own light bulb moment from his first exposure to Scrum.
[11:53] - What’s the product: Cort shares the process of translating Scrum to the swimming world.
[15:57] - How the sprint review brought everything home for Cort.
[17:03] - Evaluating how things were working with the parents of the swimmers (the stakeholders) at the weekly invitational swim meets.
[17:48] - Brian describes how Scrum helps you break things down into smaller, digestible chunks when you want to reach a big goal but don't see progress every day.
[19:02] - Cort shares how they developed the user stories for each swimmer and used feedback to develop the backlog for swim practices.
[19:44] - Cort shares the process of developing the backlog for swim practices.
[21:19] - How Agile principles (i.e., sustainable pace) translate into arenas other than software.
[24:30] - Cort explains how Scrum events like daily stand-ups and sprint reviews helped the team organize practices.
[24:47] - Which Scrum practices were harder to implement for the team? [26:47] - Opening yourself up to experimentation. (And how to reach Cort with your coaching ideas and suggestions).
[27:36] - Cort shares the biggest changes he had to make to make things work for the swim team.
[28:00] - So, who is the Scrum Master for the swim team? Redefining the Scrum roles and responsibilities to make them work in other environments.
[30:04] - Cort shares what he’s learned in the process of using Scrum with the swim team.
[33:29] - Do you have a topic or guest you'd like to see on the Agile Mentors podcast? If so, send us an email. We'd love to hear from you.
References and resources mentioned in the show
- #21: Agile Marketing Teams with Stacey Ackerman
- #23 How Agile Works in Education with John Miller
- The Agile Mentors Community
Want to get involved?
This show is designed for you, and we’d love your input.
- Enjoyed what you heard today? It would be great if you left a rating and a review. It really helps, and we read every single one.
- Got an agile subject you’d like us to discuss or a question that needs an answer? Share your thoughts with us as [email protected]
This episode’s presenters are:
Brian Milner is SVP of coaching and training at Mountain Goat Software. He’s passionate about making a difference in people’s day-to-day work, influenced by his own experience of transitioning to Scrum and seeing improvements in work/life balance, honesty, respect, and the quality of work.
Cort Sharp is the Scrum Master of the producing team and the Agile Mentors Community Manager. In addition to his love for Agile, Cort is also a serious swimmer and has been coaching swimmers for five years.
Previous Episode

#31: Starting Strong: Tips for Successfully Starting with a New Organization with Julie Chickering
Join Julie Chickering and Brian Milner as they discuss strategies you can use to get started on the right foot with your new organization.
Overview
It's the new year, and for many people, that means starting a new chapter in their life, maybe in a new position, with a new team, or possibly an entirely new organization. It's the perfect time for reflection to determine what you can do in these first few days and weeks to set yourself up for success.
So, we thought it would be a great time to take this episode of the show to highlight some strategies you can use to hit the ground running.
In this episode of the Agile Mentors podcast, Brian Milner and Julie Chickering discuss some strategies to set the stage for success in your new position. We will walk you through the vital steps for settling into your team and making an impact no matter what level of the ladder you are on. Plus, what to ask when you are interviewing to ensure you find the right fit.
Listen now to discover:
[01:40] - Julie Chickering is on the show to discuss starting strong with your new organization.
[02:15] - How to use team retrospective to identify where things are going well to amplify the good stuff while on a discovery mission of what needs work.
[03:35] - The one thing that Julie cautions about in one-on-one conversations that will help you avoid being influenced by others' opinions of their team members.
[05:22] - How to create curiosity instead of animosity by offering reciprocal grace to help everyone work better together.
[07:17] - Brian shares how to use an improvement board to keep a running track of things while identifying your next target, stay on the right track and avoid the worst-case scenario (as referenced by Henrik Kniberg in the Spotify Model - Part 2).
[09:23] - What Brian calls his 15-minute' cheat code" for understanding the dynamics of a team.
[11:31] - Julie shares her improvement backlog one-on-one ONE thing for Scrum Masters.
[12:08] - Essential techniques to help developers make an impact and utilize their skills in their new team.
[13:57] - How to get off on the right foot with a new team as a product owner.
[14:14] - Julie shares how to determine if an agile framework like Scrum is helping you meet your business goals (or not).
[15:34] - If you cannot communicate and collaborate with your stakeholders... you'll never deliver value to them.
[16:32] - How story mapping exercises can help product owners.
[18:31] - Why communication is the key to top-to-bottom team success.
[19:40] - The most important questions to ask when you are interviewing to determine if the organization is a good fit for what you bring to the table.
[22:17] - Why it's important to remember every interaction during an interview is a part of the job interview.
[22:33] - Brian shares a story of why it's crucial to determine if the company you are going to work for is looking for someone agile or Agile.
[24:42] - Why it's essential to do a background check on a company you're considering hitching your wagon to.
[25:38] - Start with where you are: how to start strong if you have the skills and are certified but need to gain experience.
[28:30] - How can you use your skills to give back and advance in your career?
[29:38] - How to highlight your experience and use it to your advantage when seeking various roles within a company.
[32:40] - The most powerful question you can ask your team that will help you start the new year fresh.
References and resources mentioned in the show
Spotify Engineering Culture - Part 2 (aka the "Spotify Model")
The Culture Code
How does project management work in Agile? with Julie Chickering
#7: The Sprint Review is not a Demo with Julie Chickering
Agile Mentors Community
Meetup
#13: What Does Cross-Functional Really Mean? with Lance Dacy
Mountain Goat Software
Scrum Alliance
Next Episode

#33 Mob Programming with Woody Zuill
Join Woody Zuill and Brian Milner as they discuss the benefits of teams working together through Mob Programming.
Overview
In this episode of the Agile Mentors podcast, Woody Zuill, a 40-year veteran software developer specializing in team interaction, joins Brian to explore the concept of Mob Programming.
Woody shares the benefits of working together rather than separating tasks in software development and how removing things like queuing, multitasking, and context switching can actually make teams more effective.
Listen in as he walks us through the collaborative software development approach's perks.
Listen now to discover:
[02:22] - Brian introduces Woody Zuill, a 40-year veteran software developer specializing in team interaction.
[02:51] - Woody explains how he discovered the term Mob Programming.
[04:56] - Where the idea of Teaming came from.
[06:20] - Woody explains why he's changing the name from mob programming to teaming.
[07:23] - Teaming = collaboration brought to software development, where more than one brain connects to do the work that needs to be done.
[11:11] - Painting the Mob Programming picture: it's when "all the brilliant minds work together on the same thing in the same space, at the same computer."
[13:40] - To work efficiently in software development, one team member acts as the driver at the keyboard while everyone else acts as the navigator.
[16:41] - The drawbacks and disconnect of breaking software development down into smaller pieces.
[18:34] - Isn't six people in one room working on one computer a waste of resources?
[21:07] - Do you want to be productive or effective? Examining the Lean concept of flow.
[24:57] - Enhancing the effectiveness of software development by removing the negative impact of waiting, queuing, multitasking, and context switching.
[25:22] - The benefits of working together vs. separating tasks in software development.
[26:53] - Team Flow: how collaboration adds to our ability to work in the zone.
[28:38] - Working together is often more effective, so why have we gotten better at it?
[31:25] - The strength of experimentation.
[33:09] - Woody explains that since the software development process is a discovery process, innovations such as mob programming can benefit the process.
[35:25] - Woody shares resources where you can find more information on Mob Programming (see the resources section below for more) and how you can contact him to schedule a workshop.
References and resources mentioned in the show:
- Software Teaming: A Mob Programming, Whole-Team Approach by Woody Zuill
- Teaming by Amy C. Edmondson
- Code with the Wisdom of the Crowd: Get Better Together with Mob Programming by Mark Pearl
- The Mob Mentality Show on Apple Podcasts
- Diffusion of Innovations by Everett M. Rogers
- Online And In-Person Training To Help You Succeed With Agile Through Mountain Goat Software
- The Agile Mentors Community
Want to get involved?
This show is designed for you, and we’d love your input. Enjoyed what you heard today? It would be great if you left a rating and a review. It really helps, and we read every single one. Got an agile subject you’d like us to discuss or a question that needs an answer? Share your thoughts with us at [email protected]
This episode’s presenters are:
Brian Milner is SVP of coaching and training at Mountain Goat Software. He’s passionate about making a difference in people’s day-to-day work, influenced by his own experience of transitioning to Scrum and seeing improvements in work/life balance, honesty, respect, and the quality of work.
Woody Zuill has been a software developer for over forty years. Woody is one of the pioneers of Mob Programming, a method of teamwork in software development that involves the entire team working together. Woody gives remote and ...
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